My Nova 16v Project

[Dar]

Spot on:thumb:
On Olly's car he just has to cut the IGN feed to the MBE system.

[dhdev (Oli)]

Woo! :D

i always have a tendancy to be non-commital and put IIRC, as I'd hate to fook someones car up haha!

[CorsaBBoomer]

Didn't read all of the 101 pages but nice project you got going on there! :eek:
Love the airbox!

As for that fia-cut-off-switch: we usually cut off the ground wire from the battery to the chassis ;)

[trackdaynova]

thanks to Dar for helping me out verbally, and also to burgo who had left me the same information on MSN as I asked him then went back out to the car, and also to Oli who was also correct - all sorted, and it works - YAY!

so out of the jobs that had to be done this bank holiday weekend i have:

> DONE - increase passenger positive castor to match drivers wheel to wheel measurement
> DONE - refit seats & harnesses, also raised drivers seat by 1 notch
> DONE - get distribution block from halfords to extend cabling to battery
> DONE - wire in fia switch > DONE - check gears as changed to internal shifter
> DONE - make rear spring retainers
> DONE - test drove it

still to do tomorrow and monday

> rear springs on
> get down to get it tracked up for now, and for donny
> get to Ashley, Walsall to have new exhaust made
> slightly adjust gear shifter, as I can easily get R, 1, 3, 4, 5 but not 2 for some reason lol
> lighten door handles
> hole cut rear bumper

I've obviously pre-loaded my new quickrack waaaayyyy too much, as I can hardly turn the wheel, I know it's going to be heavier, but its way too heavy lol so when it's up on the ramps, the big 22mm preload nut is easily accessible so I'll sort it then :thumb:

PS: how the hell did I do all those trackdays quickrackless - they're awesome!

[Jonlem]

Good work Olz, really coming along now :)

[trackdaynova]

OK - so my days work in photos...

Airbox & Ducting

First off, after giving airbox several coats of good ole; satin black, i fitted it, loving how it looks, and I nabbed our tumble dryer ducting which is a perfect fit @ 102mm ID, considering "special air ducting" is £25 per metre, in which I'd need 1.5 metres, which means paying for 2metres lol
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0785.jpg

So, I finally got to mash up my passenger headlight I bought from Craig Green ages ago (ta again), so I cut a 100mm hole in the back of that
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0787.jpg

Ran some of my favourite rubber edging around it
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0788.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0789.jpg

In risk of it coming off, I applied a small bead of clear silicone under the flaps and secured them with clips for an hour
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0790.jpg

All done!
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0791.jpg

Love this pic looking through the headlight I've made, up the tubing, might make a small sticker for the base of the headlight saying "AIR THIS WAY" and an arrow lol
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0801.jpg

[trackdaynova]

FIA Switch

Next up, not many pics as it's just wiring, but this is the said junction block I bought from Halfrauds to extend my 35mm2 wiring to my battery after going to my FIA switch, now runs down the passenger side of the exhaust tunnel instead of the drivers sill
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0792.jpg

The resistor looked quite dainty and didn't want the wire snapping, so I added bullet connectors and wrapped it black tape so it doesn't get caught on anything
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0793.jpg

Rear Spring Retainers

Then onto my rear spring retainers, take a 4mm thick steal right angle 'heavy duty shelf bracket' from B&Q (0.79p), and mark out the OD of the spring (82mm)
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0794.jpg

Drill out the centre hole to 10mm, to accomodate a M10 bolt
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0795.jpg

Weld on some 4mm sides to "hug" the spring, so it's seated correctly and cannot slide side to side, and spray matt black, of course
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0796.jpg

Now if you think where my fingers are, on the head of the bolt, this is going to be welded to my chassis and then the nut will be tightened thus holding the spring up to the bottom of my car, I'm aware the Nova rear beam pivots, which is handy because the retainer naturally sits on an angle on the spring, which will allow me to position it correctly
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0797.jpg

Castor shots

Just some pics of front wheels with castor added
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0798.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0799.jpg

Interior back in with shifter

Seats & harnesses back in with shifter, still need to tweak gears, drivers seat one notch higher, and fia switch now in and working (can see battery live cable (not fastened yet))
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0800.jpg


Once again, thanks for reading :thumb:

[Jonlem]

Looking funky mate, nice mod with the rear springs, certainly more classy than my fitting idea lol

[Adam Moran]

Really looks ace olly!

Michelle must be so forgiving ;)

[fearless]

Nice to see a different approach to retaining the rear springs -

The method I use (And a lot of the rally boys !!) - Cut a section of seat belt webbing - one end secured with a bolt/large washer through the hole in the bottom of the rear beam near the shock mount, the other end bolted via the lip on the rear chassis leg - this restricts the rear beam from dropping too far causing the spring to drop out !!!


Glad you like the quick rack - Totally transforms the whole driving experience - Won't be long before you start thinking about EPAS !!!! Especially running a plate diff !!!!!!!!!!



Dave

[novashed]

nice work ols, neat fab for the spring bracket i like it!

[leenovagsi]

hi bud thats one mint shell there nice job uvedone with engine brings back memories lol ,your garage looks mint aswell wanna pop round an sort mine lol (roof leakin again ) at the moment my gsi is standard thinkin of c20let what u think with ur project is it easier to fit the c20xe or go full on ,only way ide do the turbo converstion is to 4wd it as itll be more controlable more of the time anyways wat u think just tryin to get some ideas cheers chap

[trackdaynova]

Ad, Jon & Paul - thanks for the comments.

Dave - very interesting about limiting the drop on the beam, I might well do that aswell.

I've been doing some measurements, full droop on the beam with the bottom shock absorber bolt in (obviously) is 6inches, from the beam spring seat, upto the chassis.

Now, my spring is 4inches, and my height adjustable platform is 0.8", so at very least, my minimum total heigh (as previously said I think lol) is 4.8 inches, which could mean that I have 1.2" drop too much (should I ever get major airborn)

But I'll have to see after my cornerweighting session, as if they are mid-to full height, I won't have any gap even with the shocks at full length :thumb:

I like the idea though, should I need to limit the drop on the beam! :)

[dhdev (Oli)]

Seconded/thirded on nice work on the spring retainers, I think I'll either go that route or the beam straps at some point in the near future, think my cable tied rear springs are frowned upon :cry:

[trackdaynova]

Well, the beam straps are OK - but I'd personally wouldn't like the springs not being "held" in.

I know I know, standard Novas, and 99% of cars on the road don't have rear springs held in, but then 99% of the cars on the road don't have them this small.

I'll end up doing both, the retainers to hold them up to the car, and the straps to get rid of the "banging" should there become a gap...

We'll have to see after my visit to JamSport :thumb:

Thanks again for the interest! :)

[Adam]

Cool work as always.
Liking the spring "retainment" system :)

[novashed]

ols cant you use the same retianers on the beam too? so its all solid??

[CP]

Good work going on there - love the air box and light intake mod. Your car does you credit - very effective modification:thumb:

BTW got any advice as to the best buys available for snap off steering wheels? With my new seat in place I cant get out lol

[trackdaynova]

Cheers Ad.

Paul - not really, as thats where my height adjuster is going to be sitting, so a similar retainer will restrict the height

CP - thanks mate, really chuffed with how it's come out. Regarding 'Snap-Off' bosses, I bought mine from eBay for £27 delivered, I'll find you the link and PM you :)

OK, on with progress from today, in short - rear springs are sorted, and fixed in position! yay

Before I go any further, I must say a massive massive thank you to Matt Newey (m17tty), Rob Hirst & Andy Clay for all their help today - was wicked fun... also thanks to Michelle for the drinks and doughnuts, and also Rich!

Photos/ How To - as always from me lol

When you remove your rear spring, on the chassis you will have a locating nipple so the spring knows where to be seated
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0802.jpg

Our weapon of choice, a 40mm hole saw, after deciding a angle grinder wasn't approprate due to space
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0803.jpg

Matt gets with down and dirty with it lol
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0804.jpg

Action shot, gotta love a bit of action
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0805.jpg

Then you will be left with this
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0806.jpg

[trackdaynova]

And this can be desposed off, unless you'd like to keep it of course
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0807.jpg

Then zapp a flap disk over it to get the metal nice and shiney, so you can see your face it in
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0808.jpg

Then cut a 3.5" by 3" section of 2mm steel, which hits the circular part of the chassis perfect corner-to-corner, measured by Matt
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0809.jpg

We decided to weld the M10x35 nut onto the steel plate as it'll be stronger, a better weld, and would be easier to weld to the car, so I did this
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0810.jpg

Better pic of the B&Q brackets that I put together
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0824.jpg

And then along with the top rubber seat, this is how it will be seated
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0811.jpg

Enter Rich... (not literally) after faffing about for hours trying to get my poxy welder to work, a call to Rich, 10 minutes later he arrived and did this for us
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0812.jpg

The add the rubber seat, then the spring, then the retainer, then the M10 nut with nylock, to get this - perfec'
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0813.jpg

From below, be sure the spring is sitting central... tis!
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0814.jpg

[trackdaynova]

Here you also see how its held
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0815.jpg

The rear springs naturally sit at a "pointing back" angle, the same way the beam pivots forward, so we tried lifting the beam, and they sit absolutely perfect
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0816.jpg http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0817.jpg
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0818.jpg http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0819.jpg

Next up, remove the shims from the beams, to allow the heigh adjusters to seat correctly, and get rid
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0820.jpg

[trackdaynova]

Here is a side on view of the setup
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0821.jpg

Seats on minimum, beam lifted up to springs
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0822.jpg

All bolted up - oops too low
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0823.jpg

So we raised it 25mm lol

And even at the shocks at full droop, the spring height cannot fallout - we tried yanking them out and they wouldn't come! so all good
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0825.jpg



Really enjoyed today - learnt alot - I hope others do too from the pics!

Thanks for reading!

[novashed]

like it mate, real thought gone into that setup.

[m17tty]

looking ace olz.

[CP]

:thumb: nice work

[Adam]

Excellent work, some awesome ideas gone into this project.
Not sure how you thought up with the rear spring retainer idea, but it looks like it will work perfectly!! :cool:

What welder was that bit of welding done with, a gasless mig? Looks well

[Ste L]

very cool....

i want a set lol

[trackdaynova]

Ad - Rich used a Clarke 160 Turbo Gas with that last piece of welding :thumb:

Ste - I made another set of retainers, and also have had made another set of turned down heigh adjustable platforms to 58mm, all you'd need to do is buy yourself some 4" or 3" springs

Thanks for the lovely comments - i'm pissed as newt at mo! haha too many Kopparbergs me thinks

[Lee]

Ad - Rich ushed a Clarke 160 Turbo Gash with that lasht pieshe of welding :thumb:

Shte - I made another shet of retainersh, and alsho have had made another shet of turned down heigh adjushtable platformsh to 58mm, all you'd need to do ish buy yourshelf shome 4" or 3" shpringsh

Thanksh for the lovely commentsh - i'm pisshed ash newt at mo! haha too many Kopparbergsh me thinksh

Could have fooled me lol

Good work Captain Cheese :thumb:

[trackdaynova]

oh ya bstid that made more snese tha nmy roginal postQ!!

[Ste L]

oh ya bstid that made more snese tha nmy roginal postQ!!


need to get some of my own beer goggle's to read that lol

[Jonlem]

Nice finishing touches there Olz,

Look forward to hearing how Friday goes :)

[Lee]

Could Captain Cheese be moving towards the third nickname in as many weeks?

Colonel Sloshed lol

[Jonlem]

Could Captain Cheese be moving towards the third nickname in as many weeks?

Colonel Sloshed lol

lol lol lol

[BRoadGhost]

How come it was too low on the lowest setting?

[Ste L]

may be scrubbing on the tyres....

50 profile, so a little ballonish lol

[trackdaynova]

Just looked too low, and we couldn't match it at the fronts, due to running 3mm spacers to clear my Wilwoods, and any lower it rips the front wings to bits...

Not doing it for cosmetics, just to get it to the best it could possibly be.

lol lol lol @ my posts last night... ffs

[Ste L]

lol lol lol @ my posts last night... ffs

and MSN lol lol lol

Olz says
hiya ste

Olz says
long time no speak

Olz says
how are you matey ?

Olz says
i fecking love you

S t e - Roll on Silverstone in July (H) says
im not bad, you?

S t e - Roll on Silverstone in July (H) says
why haha

Olz says
just do


:p

[Adam]

OWNED lol


No1 rule when pi55ed, stay off the pc lol

[Jonlem]

Not quite as bad as when Spanish came on VS talking crap when drunk LOL

Last time I told Olz I loved him he asked me to stop as he thought I was sounding a bit gay

[m17tty]

Olz you were trashed last night mate!!!
I think you might be a binge drinker!!!HA HA
How are the grinding and welding burns?

[trackdaynova]

lol Owned in deed - ahh well, spread the love when drunk...

Matt - certainly was a bit worse for wear, and no, my welding burns are hurting more than ever, infact, my left hand looks like it's been in an oven or I've been to Spain and forgot to put suncream on it! lol

Been down to use the ramps, and set my tracking parallel after doing it by eye, I was miles out, also measured wheel to wheel again both sides, both identical @ 234.7cm. Also both rear arches to the ground are 53.2cm, and both front arches to the ground are 56.5cm.

I unloaded the steering rack slightly so I could actuall turn past quarter of a turn, much better to drive now

Mainly for weight gains, but also cosmetics too as I like the look of them - Thanks to Oli for the idea on his WIP...

Take a standard door handle complete @ 290grams
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0828.jpg

Remove the thick soft rubber by slicing it up with a hacksaw (always thought it was just thin plastic)... down to around 170grams
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0829.jpg

The take drill bit, 8.5mm for me, and a grinder to the face to remove some of the 3mm thickness from the metal, down to just under 2mm, drill some holes (7 for me)... and finally 120grams... spose I added a coat of paint after this lol
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0830.jpg

From this
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0826.jpg

To this
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0827.jpg

Original handles @ 290g each x 2 = 580g / over half a kilo
After handles @ 120g each x 2 = 240g ... less than one handle used to be

340g saving lol every little helps...

Yes, yes, I know - work on the driver... its happening ;)

[The Simps]

some excellent ideas on this thread olly, credit to you.

can see that dash getting chopped up next.

[ben21]

Nice one Olly, you ain't hanging around with this work are you!

[Iain]

Nice one Olly, you ain't hanging around with this work are you!

Makes everybody else look like slackers :mad:

The slimline door handles look a bit nicer actually. Would consider doing it for styling if they didn't have the holes in.

[Ste L]

Makes everybody else look like slackers :mad:

The slimline door handles look a bit nicer actually. Would consider doing it for styling if they didn't have the holes in.

just weld the little holes up , sand back, and paint :thumb:

[chrisritchie]

sorry i don't know if this has been asked but why did you now use coilovers at the back?

chris

[trackdaynova]

Couple of reasons...

Firstly... Clearence issues...

I know a couple of people with rear 1.9" Avo coilover that have no problems...

Then I hear of others having to add wheel spacers as they catch the inside of the tyre... but adding spacers means the outer edge of the tyre will catch the arch.

Turretted rears or not, clearence is always an issue so it appears. ie: having to relocate the bottom shock mount more inwards on the beam etc

With me running 888s, and looking for some even wider full race slicks, I didn't want to have to start arsing about with clearence

As you can see, even with a single thin shock, I'm still fairly close to that, now imagine a thicker shock, and a spring wrapped around it in it's stock location

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0628.jpg


Secondly... this setup - which offers exactly the same benefits as "rear coilovers" as in ride height, high poundage springs, damper adjustability, and corner weighting ability... this setup cost me only £50, as opposed to a couple of hundred :thumb:

Also - it's the way the grpA Novas were done 'back in the day', well, without the spring retainers anyway.

[ben21]

Looking sh1t hot actually mate, I may go for the same idea on the astra to get the rear ride height down, save a few pennies!

[trackdaynova]

Ben - text you mate, regarding tomorrow :thumb:

MSN ;)

[vaughanmc]

You should take the person you got it from out a blast to see what they think of their old car :)

[trackdaynova]

92 year old man, bless him... don't think he'd cope... if he's still with us.

[Adam]

... if he's still with us.
He wont be as soon as you put your foot down lol

[trackdaynova]

OK, so the final bits have been sorted, I say final, as in, thats all I'm doing to the car now...

Got to Ashleys nice and early this morning, along with ben21 from VS, and left one car at a time, and went for a spin in whosever wasn't in there
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0831.jpg

As you can see, I have had replaced the 3" diameter, 12" long bullet middle box, for a 4.5" diameter, 16" middle silencer, followed by a 3.5" diameter 16" silencer one after another.
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0832.jpg

John welding up the backbox
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0833.jpg

Full undercar shot, pretty cool to see it all in one shot
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0834.jpg

Where the standard shifter would have been, but now the bigger box is here
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0835.jpg

Under engine bay shot, look! looook! orange "motorsport" rack bushes lol
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0836.jpg

Under the rear with new suspension in shot, ready for backbox to be put on
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0837.jpg

and finally, replaced the 4" diameter, round, 12" back box, for a 7" x 4" oval 16" backbox
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0838.jpg

Fantastic result, quality product once again from John himself, now it seriously whispers along and works well in conjunction with the airbox.

All you hear now is whiiiiiiiiiiiiiiine from the gearbox... mega happy... no noise limits will be a problem now... not even Bedford should I decide to go back

[Adam]

Awesome stuff, looks cool :)

The systems are decent quality, John made the manifold and system i currently have on my car :cool:

[scott.parker]

Olly i like them center section boxes, very good, i know it's function over fanciness,but couldn't you have got the tail pipe on the left of the box to come out the cut out of the bumper?

I might get another box added and change my back box/tail pipe as it's HUGE! lol

Scott

[trackdaynova]

The box we used had a centre exit on the box for the tailpipe, with using such a big backbox to get it as quiet as possible, we needed to use a 16incher, which mean it couldn't come across that much.

To be honest, it really really doesn't bother me in the slightest lol

[scott.parker]

No i gatherd that mate,lol but least you answerd my question!

Scott

[m17tty]

see what you mean the exhaust is a work of art!! looks like a very good job done there.I also am loving the handles too olz,i cant believe they both weigh less than one original handle either.:thumb:

[trackdaynova]

aye, tis my favourite mod so far :D lol

[Martin]

wow youve been busy lol


spanking work mate

[trackdaynova]

Thanks dude - yeah i'm pretty happy with how it's going! :) :thumb:

Should certainly lose some tenths at Curborough on my next sprint I should hope, providing the weather is good again... hopefully the lap record :)

[m17tty]

have you got a close up of the handles from the front mate?

[trackdaynova]

aye mate, took one today whilst I was at Ashley

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0839.jpg

[m17tty]

look spot on,maybe bigger holes though? a bit more dtm style!

[trackdaynova]

they're currently 8.5mm, so maybe 10mms allround - oh yeahhhhh! lol :thumb:

we'll see :)

[dhdev (Oli)]

Stop being a pansy, get em filed out :p

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e296/dhdev/DSC00507.jpg

[trackdaynova]

lol they must have taken you ages!

[dhdev (Oli)]

Mechanical engineering apprenticeship means I can file like a bastid lol

[trackdaynova]

lol photographer, means my fingers can't take much abuse, so yes, I result in the first name you gave me... "pansy" lol

[trackdaynova]

Oli when you back up in t'midlands?

[dhdev (Oli)]

As said on PM, I'm back for the PV weekend from 5th-10th. Then back down here for a few days, then back in the Mids for the summer from about the 12th June till start of Oct, so I'll be living central for hitting up lots of trackdays. :thumb:

[trackdaynova]

sherrweeeet :thumb:

just about to call Magnum Motorsport now :) yay!

[dhdev (Oli)]

sherrweeeet :thumb:

just about to call Magnum Motorsport now :) yay!

Make sure you get confirmed delivery dates, as a guy off here had trouble with them recently. Personally there service has always been exceptional for me, hence why I've always recommended them :)

[trackdaynova]

MAGNUM MOTORSPORT

Bonnet - £95 + VAT
Tailgate - £95 + VAT
Wings - £60 + VAT (each)
Carriage £30 + VAT
= 340 + VAT
= £399.50 total, delivered.
or £240.87 total delivered without wings

He says he has none 'in stock on the shelf' but they can make them for me next week, should I trust them and go ahead and order... or pay a little more from somewhere where they're 'on the shelf'... ie: EuroRallye or AG Motorsport on eBay...

Suggestions?

[trackdaynova]

EURO-RALLYE
Just spoke to Ian, his prices are as follows

Bonnet - £150 all in
Tailgate - £150 all in
Carriage - £23.50 all in
Total = £323.50 all in for just the two items

Both items are on the shelf and are in stock, and can be despatched Friday for delivery on Monday... hmmm an extra £82.38 for simplicity maybe?

[Adam]

Hmm, up to you really?
Id go for the save money option really, but thats probabbly just me lol

[trackdaynova]

AG Motorsport

Bonnet - £95
Tailgate - £125
Total - £220
or £205 if you order them together
+ £30 carriage

£235 delivered next week

lol think that's the kitty :thumb:

[Adam]

Thats pretty good going :cool:

[trackdaynova]

Gonna be ordering them tomorrow :thumb:

Then need some champagne paint in cellulose... any suggestions on where to get it from ?

[Martin]

erm i think everweres just had the big switch, i kno my local paint suppilers have had to switch, they said they just had it dropped on them with no warning..

Andy(Hendrix) on here went to get the rest of his paint and they told him then.. so the inside of his car will be 2pac, the outside will be waterbased lol

[Benn]

System is very nice, and looks very well made.
Love the door handles, you'll be drilling holes all over the place soon like ants mk1 astra has..

[Benn]

erm i think everweres just had the big switch, i kno my local paint suppilers have had to switch, they said they just had it dropped on them with no warning..

Andy(Hendrix) on here went to get the rest of his paint and they told him then.. so the inside of his car will be 2pac, the outside will be waterbased lol

Find a better surpler. You can see buy it. Alot of people wont use water. I know o wouldnt wanna.

[Martin]

there isnt another place around here.. i dont need it anyway lol

i'm not fussed what my car gets painted in aslong as its a good job..

[trackdaynova]

I'm not even bothered about the good job, infact, they might even stay white lol less weight and all lol

[dhdev (Oli)]

I'm not even bothered about the good job

That's why mine have stayed rattle can matt black for so long lol

[trackdaynova]

lol is it still like that is it? lol

[dhdev (Oli)]

yep, although the bonnet is seriously scratched where it blew over at PV last year IIRC. So I may need to splash out on some rattle cans lol

[Lee]

White FG panels are the future :)

[trackdaynova]

Donington Trackday today, had a great time...

Full report here: http://www.pngclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=99012

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0845.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0844.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0843.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0842.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0841.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0840.jpg

[Jonlem]

AG Motorsport

Bonnet - £95
Tailgate - £125
Total - £220
or £205 if you order them together
+ £30 carriage

£235 delivered next week

lol think that's the kitty :thumb:

Is that from Andrew Gallagher in Scotland ?

[trackdaynova]

No mate, Andy Gibson in Yorkshire :)

[Mr.B]

EURO-RALLYE
Just spoke to Ian, his prices are as follows

Bonnet - £150 all in
Tailgate - £150 all in
Carriage - £23.50 all in
Total = £323.50 all in for just the two items

Both items are on the shelf and are in stock, and can be despatched Friday for delivery on Monday... hmmm an extra £82.38 for simplicity maybe?



andy gibson's boot is a mk2 item and ian's is mk1 :cool:

although they are quality items ian's doesn't come with hinges like andys...

adam.

[trackdaynova]

Thanks for you help Adam :thumb:

I wasn't aware that AG's were MK2 boots... in which case I'll probably go for Ians @ EuroRallye...

I'll order them in the morning... and some more pins lol

[Mr.B]

happy to help :thumb:

[mowgli]

Gonna be ordering them tomorrow :thumb:

Then need some champagne paint in cellulose... any suggestions on where to get it from ?

N R P (nuneaton replacement panels) opposite the halfords by the fountain still do it.

[Mr.B]

Thanks for you help Adam :thumb:

I wasn't aware that AG's were MK2 boots... in which case I'll probably go for Ians @ EuroRallye...

I'll order them in the morning... and some more pins lol

p.s if your fitting your boot this week show me how you do your top pins if you do :thumb:

ad

[trackdaynova]

Videos from Donington Park trackday now up on YouTube.

4 sessions in total, descriptions give you an insight of when I went out, and what I was behind

http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=trackdaynova

Enjoy!

[CP]

I've seen Ian Shirlaws fibreglass boots and bonnets and they're made properly with proper re-inforcing etc. Not cheap but you get what you pay for I guess

[trackdaynova]

With proper reinforcing comes extra weight tho I guess?

[CP]

Not really - the inside strengthening frame that is in the steel items has been replicated but in F/G. They will be significantly lighter.

[dhdev (Oli)]

I think he meant heavier than an un-reinforced FG one, in which case yes they will be heavier. I believe the Eurorallye bonnets are stronger to allow the fitment of bonnet lamp pods, whereas the Magnum one's don't have the reinforcement and are quite flexible in the middle.

[Mr.B]

bet they're about .3kg heavier if that

[trackdaynova]

Just received some photos from MikeR33 - thanks very much chap

Just a pic of my bonnet open showing the direct air intake when on track
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0853.jpg

Cool pit shot
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0852.jpg

lol three absolutely very rare exotics here (possibly my fave shot)
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0851.jpg

look where you're going Olz!
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0850.jpg

[novashed]

With proper reinforcing comes extra weight tho I guess?

my bonnet and boot are some of ians ones ols, youve had your ahnds on them!

[trackdaynova]

I'm going to be ordering them off Ian, despite being the most expensive, as people say you get what you pay for :thumb:

Not really an update, but after Donny I finally warped my disks, which I was waiting to happen, as I bought my brake kit with them being quite 'worn' if you can call them that...

Back to photo 0361 in this thread


Originally posted on 27-10-07, 06:08 PM
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0361.jpg
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0362.jpg

So thats how I bought them, and put them on, with quite a large lip - 7 months ago, 6 trackdays, 1 sprint and a fair amount of road driving too.

Exact replicas, didn't go for any fancy shizzle drilled or grooved, so here you have it a new pair of Wilwood 280 x 24s from PLR, £92 delivered bargain imo

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0855.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0856.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0857.jpg

They'll be on for PV, as I need them well bedded in for my Sprint :thumb:

[Jonlem]

Shiny bits ! I reckon your turning into a closet bufty lol

See you at PV

[trackdaynova]

well I am buying some Meguiars Clay :eek:

[Benn]

well I am buying some Meguiars Clay :eek:

I feel so proud...lol

[ben21]

well I am buying some Meguiars Clay :eek:

gaydaynova........;)

[Jonlem]

:gay:

[trackdaynova]

lol lol lol

[trackdaynova]

Was just looking through my photos to get me a new avatar... got to the Curborough folder and had a good look through...

Check this newwwwwww and improved tripod action out lol
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0858.jpg

New rear suspension/ spring setup should prevent from all this roll next time - we'll see next Sunday!
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0859.jpg

[vaughanmc]

Thats it with a rear anti roll bar as well - Do you think they make any difference ?

[trackdaynova]

Yus that is with a rear ARB, they do make a difference, just not phenominally :thumb:

[vaughanmc]

Ahh lol

Is poly-bushing hard to do ?

[trackdaynova]

Not hard at all, very simple!

http://www.turbo-nutters.co.uk/images/switch_nova/nc0091.jpg

http://www.turbo-nutters.co.uk/images/switch_nova/nc0094.jpg

http://www.turbo-nutters.co.uk/images/switch_nova/nc0097.jpg

http://www.turbo-nutters.co.uk/images/switch_nova/nc0126.jpg

http://www.turbo-nutters.co.uk/images/switch_nova/nc0129.jpg

http://www.turbo-nutters.co.uk/images/switch_nova/nc0130.jpg

[trackdaynova]

OK, so yesterday (Mon 9th) I spent the day down at JamSport having my geometry done on my Nova.

First of all - thanks to Jamie & Matty for their hard work, and Mark for organising it etc.

Tracking gauges on the front to start with to see my current state of play (toeing in 0.5mm)
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0860.jpg

Cornerweight scales come out
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0861.jpg

Equivilant of my weight was gently placed into the drivers seat... 110kg... yes yes, I know
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0862.jpg

Jamie checking current camber on front wheels (-1°), not bad as I did it by eye :cool:
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0863.jpg

Jamie then checks the rear wheels toe, and they were toeing in 1.5mm!!! :eek: (soon to be adjusted!)
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0864.jpg

Getting lowered down onto the scales. Unladened = 767kg, Ladened = 878kg, not quite as little as I'd want, however for no fibreglass panels I couldn't expect much less really
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0865.jpg

Eccentric adjustment
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0866.jpg

We had to remove this nut to get enough castor on the front wheels
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0867.jpg

[trackdaynova]

So we did, but do not fear, the rosejoint cannot move nor unscrew as it's bolted at both ends
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0868.jpg
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0869.jpg


OK so the castor was sorted, now it was onto the camber, we couldn't get anymore from the topmounts else we'd lose castor so we elongated the top hole on the shock so it could be pushed inwards
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0870.jpg


However after doing this, it was apparent that it was the driveshaft that wasn't allowing the movement in towards the centre of the car... so we elongated the holes on the bottom arms, to where the bottom ball joints sit so we could pull the bottom of the wheel out
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0871.jpg


Random undercar shot
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0872.jpg


Ohhhh feeel the castor
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0873.jpg


At home
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0874.jpg http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0875.jpg

[Adam]

Cool, all spot on now then?

What time does the Sprint kickoff on Sunday?

[trackdaynova]

So, here are the before and after results...

BEFORE ~ geometry ~ AFTER
-1.25° ~ front camber ~ -2°
+1.25° ~ front castor ~ +3°
-0.5mm ~ front toe ~ +1mm
-1.5mm ~ rear toe ~ +1mm


http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0876.jpg


http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0877.jpg


As you can see, we managed to split the front axel left to right weight distribution bang on 50/50, which as important.

We've shifted 6kg over the rear axel more, and lost it from the front - which is good

To help even the weight out - along with altering the ride height, I am to change the position of my battery from the centre of the wheel well - over to the far passenger rear as much as it can go.

65% / 35% split front to back isn't as bad as I was expecting from a stripped out Nova with a XE :thumb:

[Jonlem]

Top work Olz, yesterday sounded like a right headache for you all but its done now :)

[trackdaynova]

Cheers JB

Just noticed, the total left to right split of the car is nearer to 50/50...

But we've lost a little on the corner to corner, but as said - its all minimal.

I'm now looking for lightweight alloys, after ordering my bonnet and boot :thumb:

[Lee]

Nice one Olz :) one day ill get around to a proper setup like this as well.

[trackdaynova]

Ta dude - looking forward to Sunday even more now, especially as I'm not going as Captain Steer anymore lol

I'm in a different class now though, last time I was in Mod Prod 1401>2000cc, but I've been removed from that as 'Modified Production' means that the engine in the car must have come in the car from factory.

So I'm now in Sports Libre 1701cc>, which is a bugger, but I'm not as close to the lap record as I once thought, the lap record in that class is 28 seconds, not 36 seconds - so I'm never going to hit that.

But I am going to race against myself :thumb: anything better than 36.66s I'll be happy :)

[trackdaynova]

Adam - Sunday kicks off from 9am mate, I'll be there from 7:15ish :)

[Lee]

Good luck. Mind the hedge lol

[Adam]

Adam - Sunday kicks off from 9am mate, I'll be there from 7:15ish :)
Cool, see you there :D

[burgo]

thats some fancy bit of kit they've got. will be interested to hear the out come on handling after a proper set-up

[trackdaynova]

I'm aware now, in hindsight, that -2degrees negative camber is quite alot. lol

Well, not for a full out track car, but for the travelling to and from a track, could get through the insides of the tyres quite quickly lol

[Benn]

Thats one hell of a tracking set up..

[MC]

All looks good, but I would add a note of caution. Generic FWD settings work well, but to get it right you really need to drive it and adjust to your particular car, the track conditions and your style of driving. Also you need to make these changes in a scientific manor to see what difference they make. Have you made any other mods since your last track outing that may mask the benefits? Will you play around with these settings?

How many practice runs will you get? It can take time to get used to the very best setting as it may feel like its initially very loose but once you build confidence, translate into a balanced slide.

If you are worried about the camber and tyre wear, mark the positions and adjust it back for your road miles.

I look forward to seeing your results, good luck, and this is still my favourite build thread!

MC

[broster]

good to see the car again, hope to see some results from the work carried out on it!

mark

[trackdaynova]

Thanks for the reply MC.

I have added a Quikrak since my last sprint, which I know will make alot of difference alone, so if I do beat my PB, I know it won't solely be down to the geometry.

I'm happy with the castor aspect, as I can only imagine that it's going to ad benefits to the handling of the car, the tracking, I've always previously ran 1mm toe in, so might take a bit of getting used to, converting to 1mm toe out. Regarding the camber, I used to run around -2degrees negative on my white one, which felt great in corners on track, but obviously I will only feel this on track, as I don't tend to drive like a loon on the roads etc

On Sunday I shall get 2x practice runs (however they are timed, but do not contribute towards the Championship) followed by at least 2 timed runs.

It's funny how you should mention it feeling loose, as when I was driving home from having it done - it didn't feel as tight as it previously did - but they, as you've stated thats because I've had the chance to get used to it etc.

I can only assume what I've changed and had done will be an improvement to my previous settings, and then here on in will be continuous weightloss, and more tweeks.

What are your thoughts?

[MC]

My thoughts?

erm........Food.........


Seriously, the basic idea of the settings is right and I have come to the conclusion that the better ones car gets and the better one drives, the harder it is to improve and the easier it is to get it wrong. One thing affects another!

On the weight loss......apart from what some other less tactful members may point out.....loose the fecking passenger seat! Its pointless weight on a sprint and on track days having a passenger slows you down, ruins the handling, places extra stress on the engine and eats through the brakes and tyres more quickly!

[MC]

I have an idea for changing between dry and wet settings. Our car was pants in the wet at llandow and thats because its far too hard. Silly high poundage springs!

Buy a cheap general 40mm drop kit and have it built up complete with standard strut tops. You can change over fairly quickly and it'll be far better in the wet than our current setup. It's better than compromising spring choice and easier than swapping springs alone. What do you think?

MC

[Lee]

I have an idea for changing between dry and wet settings. Our car was pants in the wet at llandow and thats because its far too hard. Silly high poundage springs!



lol, tell Chip that

[MC]

? Ellaborate?

M

[trackdaynova]

Car has to have two fixed front seats at a minimum to run in a Sprint and in the class I'm in - so they have to stay... also - on trackdays, half the fun for me is having a passenger and experiencing it with mates.

I was dead happy with my suspension setup in the very wet conditions at Combe, so I hope to have kept a little bit of a compromise down to shock stiffness

I know I could do with losing a few pounds, but the fact is I am me, if I am the larger than life type of guy then I gotta get my car weight down as much as possible :)

[MC]

I'm about three stone heavier now than when I had my white Nova! All muscle of course.

MC

[trackdaynova]

Well I could get back down to 100kg again, thats 10kg lost... easy enough :thumb:

Still got my fibreglass bits to order though.

[nova ian]

Nice one Olly, Should go well this sunday with all the changes.

Do you have all the measurements of how the car was before it went to Jamsport?

If I was you I'd be tempted to get a notebook and note down all measurements, such as before, After (ie. as it is now) and then if any other changes are made keep it noted down.

That way you can have a play with settings and without fear of loosing what feels good. This is how we used to set the stock car up for different tracks etc...

You got the fuel pump sorted?

See you sunday mate:thumb:

[trackdaynova]

Fuel pump not sorted yet, however thats on my 'to do' list along with put the steering wheel straight, and move the battery over to rear passenger side.

I'm also looking forward to Donny evening open pit again, fancy going out on my own now its been set up just with me in it :thumb:

[chrisritchie]

if you don't mind me asking but how much did it cost you to get your car set up

[trackdaynova]

Here are the standard charges:

http://www.vauxhall-sport-forum.com/phpBB2/flatout-chris-astley-astra-mk4-let-t6581,highlight,%2520.html

[chrisritchie]

ok thanks which one did you have done

[trackdaynova]

Gold with rear tracking too :thumb:

[chrisritchie]

sorry one more:tard: do you know if at all where i can get adjustble rosejointed tie bars?

thanks chris

[trackdaynova]

Yeah, speak to either: lee303 on mig, jonlem on here, or jamsport themselves

All can either make you them, or get them made :thumb:

[chrisritchie]

thanks:thumb:

[trackdaynova]

No probs.

As I'm wanting to still lower my COG slightly, I am now looking into buying some 4 door front wings, as these are round and the lip could be flaired out, could look euro, but I'm not bothered about that, just want clearence to no longer being an issue.

They might look odd on a 3door, but the fact is, I'm more concerned how my car performs than I do it looks. Do you know if 4 doors were also made in Champagne colour?

[trackdaynova]

Does anyone have a side on shot of a 3door Nova Hatch with 4door round front wings on please?

[Ash]

There was talk of getting some F/G front wings made, not wide arched but very flared. I was interested at the time but iirc it just died out as no-one could supply good wings to make the moulds.

[trackdaynova]

How would a mould be made unless someone made some custom flaired steel items? or was that the plan?

[Jonlem]

sorry one more:tard: do you know if at all where i can get adjustble rosejointed tie bars?

thanks chris

Empty your PM box ;)

[trackdaynova]

Chris - if you're not looking at going stupid camber, then my tiebars will be for sale, as I need shorter ones in order to get more :)

[chrisritchie]

the ones that are on your car at the moment?

[trackdaynova]

Yup :thumb:

[chrisritchie]

ooh , what do you what for it?

[chrisritchie]

you have PM

[lee303]

geometry looks good olly, but i would want to keep an eye on the rose joint without the lock nut, not because it will come undone, but the threads arent the tightest fit in the thread inserts and so not having a locknut will give a little movement, which will eventually break the rose joint, have you got enough room for a skimmed down nut?

[trackdaynova]

Yo Lee, Your first post on my thread! Welcome :)

Yah, Jamie did say that I have to keep an eye on them, as there will be slight movement on the threads moving up and down, aswell as in and out.

I will see if there is enough for a slimmed down nut, alternative, I'll just get another pair of shorter tiebars made up, As I can use my current RJs.

Thanks for your pointers on the settings :thumb:

[lee303]

no worries, it will wear the joint out pretty quick, as they dont like that sort of shock loading, maybe take a spare to the sprint if you can, as you say, an easy fix anyway though

[trackdaynova]

hmmm spare RJs? not much time to get them now :(

[lee303]

rally design will next day if you order tommorow am, just make sure which thread you need, left or right, part numbers are HMR8-10T for right and HML8-10T

[dan16v]

Olly, only just realised it was you from the mig days from Ricks post! thought you had dissapeared!
car looks ace!

[trackdaynova]

rally design will next day if you order tommorow am, just make sure which thread you need, left or right, part numbers are HMR8-10T for right and HML8-10Tlol fecking hell child - nice one! I'll get them ordered tomorrow, are they the original ones that you supplied in the first place then?

Dan - c'moooooon get with it lad :D lol Thanks for the comments

[lee303]

yeah, i know the numbers off by heart now, they are the heavy duty ones, 31,000 lbs static loading

[LiquidPug]

Car has to have two fixed front seats at a minimum to run in a Sprint and in the class I'm in - so they have to stay...
Olz, how about one of these: Item No.110260715172 or cut the guts out of a poverty spec seat, no one has to sit on it for the sprints, so it doesn't have to be comfortable.


Does anyone have a side on shot of a 3door Nova Hatch with 4door round front wings on please?
Not a comparison pic, but 4 door wings on thread 89985, - any good??

Postie, postie :thumb:

p.s can't include links yet :wtf:

[trackdaynova]

Wahhheeyyyy here he is! :D

Good find on the seat, I probably won't go down that route as I like to drive it on the road exactly the same as I do on the track.

I think the fibreglass bonnet, boot and carbon doors will do me :wisewood:

Moved the battery out of the wheel well tonight, to aid my cornerweights - so I'm going to get an alloy sheet to revit in place :thumb:

[LiquidPug]

alloy sheet across the whole boot floor, so you've got a flat surface to mount the battery holder to :confused:

[trackdaynova]

I'll just remove the wheel well itself, and replace the shape with a flat alloy sheet, but I'll have it pressed, so it doesn't "bong" at high speeds

[m17tty]

youve got some serious stuff done to the nova since i last had chance to log in

Looking sweet olz! :thumb:

[trackdaynova]

plenty more to come matt - i'll be on it all day saturday preparing for the sprint should you want to pop over both (Ste & Matt)

let me know :thumb:

[dhdev (Oli)]

I'm in a different class now though, last time I was in Mod Prod 1401>2000cc, but I've been removed from that as 'Modified Production' means that the engine in the car must have come in the car from factory.

So I'm now in Sports Libre 1701cc>, which is a bugger, but I'm not as close to the lap record as I once thought, the lap record in that class is 28 seconds, not 36 seconds - so I'm never going to hit that.


Aha! They finally collared you then, thought you'd got away lightly, as that is the class I got told I'd have to run in ;)

[trackdaynova]

Not 1701cc > you won't be :p as you have a small cock don't forget lol

Looking forward to seeing you Sunday btw, we hardly spoke PV day...

Motorway was hilarious :thumb:

[Benn]

So they bumped you up as class cause the engines over the 1998cc of cause of the tbs and bits?

[trackdaynova]

Nope they moved me class because a Nova was never built with a 2.0, which is what I explained to them, and they just said I was in the correct class.

Oh well - I'm up against a 2000cc Turbocharged Morris Minor this Sunday lol

[BRoadGhost]

Hmm interesting reading some of this :)

So in terms of feeling ~ the turn in doesn't seem as sharp now the rear carries more weight?

I wonder why they weren't able to balance the RR & RL like the front as now there's an even greater imbalance. Was it just that the height adjustment on the rear isn't quite enough to drop 1 corner enough?

2º isn't the end of the world now it's all tracked on a car that's not the stiffest and will give the footprint you're after when cornering hard.

Does the revised settings give more initial understeer you think now?

[trackdaynova]

Hi Si,

I've literally drove it home from JamSport, and thats it, so it was alot of motorway and couple of roundabouts.

I'll do a proper "feedback report" after Sundays Sprint

Thanks for the interest though - its nice to see other people throwing ideas in :thumb:

[BRoadGhost]

Sure i guess trying to sumise these things on the road isn't the safest of places, but you might be focusing on driving as fast as possible on a sprint event rather than evaluating certain characteristics?

[trackdaynova]

Yup - once again you're correct.

Not really ideal to get into these speeds that we're talking of on the road

And as you say, the sprint starts and finishes so quickly (36s) as you say, its hard to tell.

Therefore, I will come back with results from the trackday I've just booked at Donington Park again on Friday 18h July, but I have another Sprint before then on Sunday 13th July, a double lapper at Curborough :thumb:

[craig green]

Great reading on the geometry setup Olly. If I had the cash........

I'll be interested to hear your feedback after the event. Hope it pays off anyway.

[trackdaynova]

Cheers CG - well gutted I missed you at PV - still not met you after what... 8 years of internet dealings lol

Got a small list of bits I need to do to the car tomorrow before the sprint, I will probably come back with pics, despite there being nothing to take pics of lol

[trackdaynova]

Well all the important jobs are done for tomorrow.
- re-centred steering wheel, dead easy with snap off system
- put new brake pads in, but have to put some serious mileage on them today to bed them in
- finished relocating battery to rear left
- sort out a dodgy stud/ nut on my wheels
- slightly modified chassis to gain clearence on steering arms lol

brake pad swap in process
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0878.jpg

ferodo ds2500s
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0880.jpg

whilst putting them on, i noticed i was not getting full full lock, and due to castor changes,
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0882.jpg

the steering arm was fouling
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0881.jpg

got the hitting stick out and sorted that for clearence

and new battery position which helps a great deal
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0879.jpg

[Adam]

Cool, be good see it at the sprint tomorrow

[Jonlem]

Looks good Olz, I forgot to mention I had to do the same to Ads shell to get the steering arms through.

Best of luck tomorrow :thumb:

[m17tty]

olz ive gotta say im absolutely shocked!!!!! And speechless too!!!!!

All will become clear!

[Benn]

Looks good dude.

[trackdaynova]

Well, today has been an absolutely shocking eye opener to be honest.

[Martin]

what happend olz?

[Ste L]

Well, today has been an absolutely shocking eye opener to be honest.

whats happened fella?

[Adam]

Hes been to DhDevs, and is speechless/amazed at what a small block can do lol






(to be serious for a second, i hope its nothing bad??)

[Dar]

I hope it's nothing bad. Time to fire up MSN can find him.

[Ste L]

I hope it's nothing bad. Time to fire up MSN can find him.



i did the same, but he's dont seem to be on

[dhdev (Oli)]

Hes been to DhDevs, and is speechless/amazed at what a small block can do lol






(to be serious for a second, i hope its nothing bad??)

Maybe the other way round :eek::eek::eek:

[Dar]

Very possibly.

[CP]

ooh a cliffhangerlol

[Jonlem]

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :roll:

[Dar]

lol I hope hes not been typing something up all this time. It will take a age to read!

[trackdaynova]

OK, so here goes, I was going to email JamSport but I might aswell update my thread just as I would do anyway.

Not happy at all after today, infact, completely shocked, appauled and annoyed.

A couple of things I kept quiet about within the past week because I gave them the benefit of the doubt, but on the day of having my geometry setup, the YTS lad stripped the thread on my wheel stud by putting on the wheel bolts with an airgun without winding them up on a couple of threads first. But Jamie (the boss) assured me that they'd removed the wheel nut from the stud, applied lock tight put the stud back in, and it was fine.

Well, today - I changed my brake pads as you've seen above to find that removing my wheel nuts, with my stud still attached to it - and no threadlock on the section that went into the hub... great... spent the best part of an hour removing it and cleaning up the threads.

Something else, which I wasn't too bothered about but now everything else has been uncovered, it seems like the way it is. When Matty (YTS lad) was using an angle grinder to grind down the back of the knuckle on the hub, he sliced through my CV boot, and admitted it and said he'd already told Jamie (the boss) but nothing was mentioned and it wasn't replaced. Great... CV boot grease everywhere, and now needs replacing

OK - so thats what I already knew about, I wasn't happy but hey... I kept quiet...

Today, I got my car out today first time since my drive back from JamSport, and changed my brake pads and found the above.

Then Matt (m17tty) turned up and we headed over to Oli's (dhdev) house as he wanted to use my laptop, on the way over I was telling Matt that it still felt very loose, after travelling 22miles to Oli's we noticed that I could turn the steering wheel a quarter of a turn, but the wheels were not turning.

Very strange we thought, so let Oli have a drive and he pulled over immediately and refused to drive the car any further, so I jumped in.

First of all we thought it was the snap-off boss moving, nope solid, then we thought it was the splines of the steering wheel column skipping teeth - but everything looked fine.

Then we even doubted the fitting of the quikrack, and the tensionor, maybe I hadn't preloaded it and it was skipping teeth - but for how big the teeth were on the pinion and rack - this would have been impossible.

So, I asked Matt to hold the passenger wheel still, and Oli to hold the drivers wheel still, whilst I tryed to turn the steering wheel - to much of our amazment, the camber was changing on the wheels in their hands, allowing the steering wheel to move, but the wheels weren't. The bolts were loose!

We immediately whipped the wheel off to find the 2x 19mm bolts holding the strut to the hub carrier were loose, in fact, Oli set his torque wrench on the lowest setting of 40nm, and it didn't even click it just turned and tightened them up so it was less than 40nm!!! it turned the bolts, shocking. These in the Haynes Manual should have been 120nm+!

Then as you do - you go on to investigate other bits and bobs, to find that the elongated holes on the bottom ball joints, these were also finger tight, not tight at all... bottom ball joints... does this explain it feeling loose whilst driving?

Looking around, where the bolts pass through the rosejoints on the front panel, one of the bolts have a washer under the nut, and the other doesn't... despite this looking insignificant, it's not, it is significant as its again a lack of quality checks

Whilst the passenger wheel was off - Matt (m17tty) noticed the massive chunks out of the inside of my Toyo 888 where it had been randomly hitting the inside of my passenger wing where the wheel had been moving erratically due to not being bolted up correctly - so a new tyre is now needed as I've had to checked and they've wrote a nigh brand new 888 off.

What annoys me is I expressed this concern to Mark Broster at JamSport that this YTS lad only tightened these bolts with a 6" ratchet, and even 16stone of me still uses a foot long scaffold bar to make sure they're FT.

It just shocks me, not that it should matter, but this is a trackday / sprint car that is driven on the roads aswell - so when it is driven, its not driven slowly, or softly.

It just really shocks me that they've let this car out of their workshop with these bolts not tight enough, not torqued up.

Myself and JamSport need to have talks, beacuse now I have my Sprint tomorrow, and what I paid for only 5 days ago has gone out the window, and we're back to "by eye". And a Toyo R888 wheel which is foooked.

I now have to pay another company to get all my geometry rechecked, and re-set up.

I am just sooooo thankful that Oli needed my help today, and I took the drive over to find this out, it doesn't bare thinking about what would have happened tomorrow at the sprint with all of these components loose.

Oli & Matt are the ones that diagnosed these loose bolts which makes me glad that some other people were there to back up these findings.

I have now tightened up all the relevant bolts and the car does feel very tight, and very positive - altho my geometry is yet again - out the window, as now the camber isn't bang on identical both sides and now it pulls to the passenger side.

JamSport have my number, so they can give me a call alternatively I'll be calling them first thing Monday morning to sort this out one way or another.

I definately want a refund for what effectively has been a sham.

Very disappointed, and I really didn't want to be posting this up - its not a lynching, it is true to life facts of what has happened today, and the findings.

I hope everyone understands why I've posted this up - as I would be feeling very guilty if people went to JamSport off the back off raging positive review, when in fact they would be let down exactly the same as I have.

[Jonlem]

Dissapointed for you Olly, disgraceful service

[trackdaynova]

lol I hope hes not been typing something up all this time. It will take a age to read!Unfortunately Dar, this is true.

I have typed, deleted, re-worded, re-typed, deleted it so many times.

I hate having to give bad reviews, but I feel my life was at risk whilst driving that car, it was very dangerous

[Adam]

Jesus, you could of been here typing a very different reply if something had fell out whilst driving. Luckily you/matt/oli spotted it.

[t45_ste]

I feel my life was at risk whilst driving that car, it was very dangerous

Thats the main point. Could of been very very seious!

[chrisritchie]

This is not the first time i have heard if JamSport letting themselves down

[Ste L]

****.....

thankfully you checked it out, or could of have sooo much worse :eek:

[Dar]

Cripes! That is crazy! I say good on you Olly for that service people should know so that they can avoid the place.

You pay for the top notch service and they effectivley just loosen bits on the front end and knacker up other bits.

Im just glad we arn't reading what could have been a nastier 'crash' type thread that this could have easily turned in to.

[broster]

Olly, i have messaged you for your number i dont have it at home.

[dhdev (Oli)]

I blame the weight of the engine.....:wtf:

Seriously though, these were very basic mistakes that could have had a nasty outcome indeed. Glad we spotted/sorted these things in time. I'm sorry I didn't take the time to check over the other bolts whilst we had it up tho :(

[broster]

I would just like to take this opportunity to publically appologise to Olly for the way his car turned out, I have just come off the phone to Olly now, i can appreciate what he has said on here and why he has said what he has said, its such a shame it has come to this.

I have just spoken to Olly on the phone discussed several things with him, he has shead some light on matters I was unaware of, because of this unprofessional behaviour from certain staff members i will be taking action myself on monday morning.

Olly has been given several options, which ever he takes is his choice, due to the damage caused to his tyre we shall either purchase him 2 new 888's or he can purchase his own and invoice us for them, again his call.

in an ideal world i would like to collect the car and put the wrongs right, Olly knows this, he is thinking about it, there is absolutly NO hard feeling towards Olly due to his post.

I would like to make this a point very very clear, we are a professional company, we dont mistreat customers cars, we do work on some high profile cars and generate very good results, this is a problem and we will rectify it one way or another, we will NOT ignore it.

Olly, good luck tomorrow and I shall speak to you later on.


Kind regards

Mark @ JAM-sport

[Dar]

Fair play!

Mistakes get made in this world, thats just life. It's how we deal with them that matters and that reads spot on :thumb:

[MC]

I blame the weight of the engine.....:wtf:

+1 rep lol

[Rick Draper]

Dont know whats happened but glad everything is all ok and whatever has happened has not caused a crash or serious injury.

[m17tty]

Id just like to add to this thread that im glad broster and olly have spoken to each other and it sounds like some compromise has been reached.However i cannot believe what i saw saturday BUT mistakes do happen and thats just life.Jamsport have a good reputation and im sure they are more than professional in all areas too.

I hope everyone comes out with solution make everyone happy as im sure this will be the case.

That is all!

Bo!

:thumb:

[Mr.B]

have you got your fibreglass panels sorted? if so who did you go with?

[Jim]

I blame the weight of the engine.....:wtf:


+1 rep lol

and another, teeheehee

[CP]

Without wishing to comment on any of the specifics of Olly's situation I would just like to point out as a balancing comment for anyone who is considering using their car on track that it is very common for adjusted/modded/re-placed and re-fitted items to come loose shockingly quickly!I have literally had to put a spanner on virtually everything on all my modded conversions from suspensions components through to all of the engine even though I'm experienced enough to make sure stuff was tightened correctly in the first place. If you look round competition prepped stuff you will usually see fixings marked or drilled and wired so beware!:)

[Benn]

So what happened?

[Martin]

hmmi was ment to be at a party at 8 but waited until the last minute to see what happend and then nothin got posted and now i cant read what happend :(

[The Simps]

We had to do a bolt check once a month on my old turbo as they would always find a way of vibrating loose! Even the locknutted ones.

Not sure what happened but guess something fell off/cae loose. Hope you can get it sorted and get back on track.

[trackdaynova]

Yup - not saying a bolt check isn't required after a trackday, or a couple of hundred miles, or less.

But this was literally one 46mile journey, then it sat for a week.

Speaking to JamSport again today to sort something out

[The Simps]

what came loose then?

[The Simps]

actually, you probably won't answer that I'm guessing.


Just read your report.

I'm in 2 schoold of hought here. Either the rear toe is causing it to be unpredictable or it is too stiff and you can't feel the car getting to the point it wants to slide until its gone?

[craig green]

I've added some rear toe out to my Nova on the rear stub axles bolts. I've barely driven it but the rear does fell very 'unplanted'. Is that anything like what you are experiencing Olly?

[General Lee]

That vid on youtube, on the curborough spring looked pretty god damn scary mate, hope your car is ok.

[trackdaynova]

CG - exactly that, it almost feels as if it's RWD but in a very very odd sense, it doesn't feel as 'suckered/ planted' to the road as it used to - but maybe this is because of the front 'guessed' settings we've done.

nath - certainly got my adreniline going thats for sure!

[fearless]

Sorry to hear about your problems - I'm sure you'll sort them eventually

One thing that does concern me is your rear geometry - toe out ?


Basic rule of thumb,for a good all round clubman set up

Front:
1.5- 2.0 deg. negative camber
Try for the maximum castor you can get with whatever tca/tie bar set up you have on the car,increased castor will assist turn in.
(Note if on nylon or rubber tca bushes at chassis mount side beware of pulling the tca too far forward when going for maximum castor or you will distort the bushes and restrict bump & rebound travel)

Tracking:
1mm per side TOE OUT

Rear:
1/4 to 1/2 deg negative camber
Tracking +- 1mm-2mm toe in (NEVER TOE OUT) unless you are going in for the national drift championships!

Of course this is only a good basic starting point,a cars overall handling will also depend on bump steer,spring ratings,damper bump & rebound spec,bodyshell stiffness ect.

The above set up which is considered the ideal set up data is taken from the original GM GpA cars.

So bottom line is- set up the car so you the driver feel comfortable and confident with it.

If you need to fight the car on every bump/corner,then it's wrong,change the settings,test and test again until you feel at one with the car,then you will see your times tumble.. :thumb:




Dave

[trackdaynova]

thanks for replying Dave :thumb:

I have identical front geometry setup to what the Nova grpA build manual says, apart from build manual says have 4degress positive castor.

However I could only get 3deg pos castor, as my tiebars are too long - so I'm having some shorter ones made, and replacing my inner TCA bushes for rosejoints too, then I will go for 4degress positive. Providing clearance isn't an issure on the tyres - if it is a problem, then I will take a grinder to the front of my wings.

Front camber is (was) -2degrees.
Front toe is 1mm toe out

When I return to JamSport, I am keen to return my rear geometry back to factory 1mm toe IN, they did advise me it would introduce oversteer, but I like to provoke it, rather than it happening on a whim.

I understand I need to test it, thing is I had it done on Monday, found some issues on Saturday, then Sprint on Sunday - so it was impossible. Especially as I wouldn't drive at the speeds it could be tested on the roads, I'd wait until my next trackday

[BRoadGhost]

Hmm interesting this one.

Maybe I should apologise for saying "not the stiffest chasis" looks like you're pretty much there.

Thing is I've seen this behaviour before on a BMW and the only thing I can conclude is it's transfering the weight just too quickly for the ride height and other aspects of the setup.

When you reach this lvl you will find absolute limits for the settings. Understand that without lowering the car more to counter the tip, you won't get round the bend any faster as you'll just get under/over steer instead.

You should feel proud that you've pushed things this far.

Have you seen the video of a trials mini that can brake so hard the front tips into a massive endow? The setup is so good it's now up to the driver to make it go anywhere up to that stage of weight transfer.

Only by turning in slower and/or taking a wider line at that speed could you hope to keep the car more level given how it is now. Adding weight and/or areodynamic aids / lowering center of gravity will be the only path to that corner again at that speed or faster.

Sorry to say it but understand how a car feels / behaves in terms of under / over / neutral steer does not always correlate with time taken. ~That setup might be the fastest you can make it without altering any of the 3 above mentioned.

And I guess that's what it comes down to; having a car that's only 99% as fast but feels 99% safer and gives you the confidence to consistanly perform. Deciding what's best for a sprint only car might be quite different to say a circuit racer where things like tyre preservation are a key factor.

[dhdev (Oli)]

When you reach this lvl you will find absolute limits for the settings. Understand that without lowering the car more to counter the tip, you won't get round the bend any faster as you'll just get under/over steer instead.
Only by turning in slower and/or taking a wider line at that speed could you hope to keep the car more level given how it is now. Adding weight and/or areodynamic aids / lowering center of gravity will be the only path to that corner again at that speed or faster.


He needs to avoid the 'molehill' to get round there quicker ;)

[The Simps]

lol

[BRoadGhost]

Is that all it was?

Not the new settings?

[dhdev (Oli)]

Yeah, he caught the inside on the infamous 'molehill', quite a large raised curb section. I'm sure the stiffer suspension was less forgiving though.

[Adam]

On his other runs the wheel was lifting off too, but a manageable/safe amount compared to when he caught the kerb.

[trackdaynova]

Simon - thanks again for your reply :thumb:

I hear what you're saying, and I am thoroughly proud of where I've got the car to, and how it's going considering it's only my second attempt at Curborough.

I agree with what I'm having to do regarding getting around the course quicker, and I feel lowering the COG will help me get there.

Obviously when I return for the double lapper in July, I will have correctly running fuel pumps for one, and I will have also of been back to JamSport for my geometry again.

I'm certainly wanting to change my rear toe back to 1mm toe in, as Oli has stated (not sure if its in this thread) but those that have seen me drive know I'm particulary agressive and thrive off getting it out of shape but keeping it under control (where possible).

I'll keep all of my original front settings of 4deg pos castor, 2deg neg camber and 1mm toe out.

My previous time at Curborough show I was happy with the car due to my consist times of 36.99, 37.01, 37.03, 36.79 and 36.66.

As stated previously, this visit wasn't so consistant, however my new personal best is 35.92, which I'm sure I can get down to the 34's.

[dhdev (Oli)]

I'm sure I can get down to the 34's.

course you can tyrone :thumb:

[Rick Draper]

Toe out on the rear would bring in some very strange handling and induce wander from the rear in a straight line IMHO. I think if you want the cars suspension setting up i would be going to somewhere that road rallys fwd cars with rear beams, not some bunch of chancers who happen 2 have some tracking, camber/caster and corner weight gauges. Thats if you are going to trust anywhere again or you might just be aiming to try different things yourself while at track days and sprints as its very much a personal feal thing. What works for one will not work for most etc.

[The Simps]

I think if you want the cars suspension setting up i would be going to somewhere that road rallys fwd cars with rear beams, not some bunch of chancers who happen 2 have some tracking, camber/caster and corner weight gauges.


I don't think its overly relevant tbh.

As long as the "chancers" know how to use the equipment they can set the car up to "your" specs. Surely thats the importance here.

[broster]

Toe out on the rear would bring in some very strange handling and induce wander from the rear in a straight line IMHO. I think if you want the cars suspension setting up i would be going to somewhere that road rallys fwd cars with rear beams, not some bunch of chancers who happen 2 have some tracking, camber/caster and corner weight gauges. Thats if you are going to trust anywhere again or you might just be aiming to try different things yourself while at track days and sprints as its very much a personal feal thing. What works for one will not work for most etc.

If the "chancers" comment was aimed at us then i would just like to point out that yes we did have some issues with Olly's car, we are having the car back to set it up again. Also we have set up many many cars, both road cars, weekend track toys and full on purpose built touring cars, so we have a fair bit of experience in setting geometry up.

Also the tail happy-ness in our opinion is mainly caused but the front turning in alot better than before combined with the stiff spring used on the car.

Olly will be bringing his car to Bruntingthorpe with us and we shall be doing some testing there and getting some on the day feed back on what works for him, making some adjustments whilst we are there to make sure its right for how he drives, we agree getting settings out of a book can be a good starting point, however to refine it to ones driving style takes some time and cant be done by rule of thumb.

If Olly feels its a bit tail happy, we can change that.

[trackdaynova]

OK, so... I'm returning to JamSport in early July for a re-setup on castor, camber, toe, re-do cornerweighting - and putting rear toe back to 1mm toe in... how... I don't know, but I'm sure they'll have a way to do it.

Not going into depth what agreement we've come to, but I'm a great believer that everyone deserves a second chance, no matter how silly/ ridiculous/ dangerous the first mistake was.

JamSport wanted my car back, so they could prove to me, and everyone else that they are capable of doing such work.

We've come to some agreements where both parties are happy with whats going to happen.

[trackdaynova]

It'd be scandelous not to have some of my latest Sprint pics in here too - as I don't want this thread to lose track of what it is...

So here are some piccies from Sunday 15th June, Curborough Sprint lol

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0888.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0886.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0884.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/nc0883.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/OllyWriteOff.jpg

[trackdaynova]

three posts in a row - ohhh errrr...

OK - so I'm having a completely new lower suspension setup fabricated (prior to my revisit to JamSport), with some shorter tiebars so I can achieve +4degrees positive castor, and still run a locknut on the rosejoint, aswell as these, I am having some boxed off TCA's with rose jointed inners fabricated also.

I've decided to leave my current 300lb front, 450lb rear spring setup, simply because I don't think I've gave the car enough testing to know whether it's that or not.

I'm leaning towards not, as I have done a trackday at Donington (when I went with ben21 in his Astra Saloon) and the photos from there show how stable the car is through corners where I'd normally be toppling over.

I do however still want to lower the car moreso, without scrubbage and the like - so I'm on lookout for some 4/5 door / saloon front wings so they're round and I can get them flaired.

Was wondering how they'd look, but to be honest I'm not fussed...

When I had my white Nova and I crashed it, I bought some 5 door front wings not knowing they were different back then... here are some pics...

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/Ragga5.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/Ragga4.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/Ragga2.jpg

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/Ragga1.jpg


Obviously a full side on photo would have been better, lol, but the car wasn't at it most photogenic back then lol

[The Simps]

should have just started with a coup mate - its the future ;)

[trackdaynova]

right thats it. i'm gonna reshell lol

[dhdev (Oli)]

Front wings will be a cool mod :thumb:
Although there is a wide track pilbeam suspension setup on ebay at the moment....;)

[trackdaynova]

Yup - I've seen lol

Front wings wont be standard, the vertical piece will be pulled out to match the 45degree angle

Might look euro, but thats not the look I'm aiming for

[Adam Moran]

I think the front wings look uber cool... you are going to do the rears too tho yeh??

[trackdaynova]

Nope, no need - rears don't scrub, well, they do, but they don't cause any problems...

This is with your old 90mms
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q161/neocapture/Bobb01.jpg

and I won't be going any lower than this.

As well as this, it'd be hard to do a rear round arch conversion without it looking gash, as from a 4door, the arch is made up from a part of the rear door also.

I'm not wanting to be spending any money on body work, welding, fillering, primering, painting, as it's not that type of car, and its just adding more weight.

[Martin]

use another pair of front wings for the rears ;)

just cut the round bit of..