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great work colin.
this is a lovely car :D
dhdev (Oli)
30-05-10, 03:34 PM
So very :cool:
Nice work Colin!
16v Nova Kev
30-05-10, 04:51 PM
this thing well need a set of wings soon.:)
how much do u think it will way when its finished?
Wow, excellent work on the weight saving, this car will be seriously light with the changes you are making.
novarally
31-05-10, 09:19 AM
how much do u think it will way when its finished?
My target is 570kg.
With my plans for more power, that should put me on a much more even footing with the top Minis that I race against. The quickest of those is Jim White's, with 180bhp and is 550kg;
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/Simons20iphone20102.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/Simons20iphone20172.jpg
This is a proper serious machine!
Mini is amazing! What engine is that colin? cc?
Mini is amazing! What engine is that colin? cc?
Ford Duratec?
novarally
31-05-10, 10:08 AM
Mini is amazing! What engine is that colin? cc?
It's a 1400cc A Series block, topped with a BMW K100 16v motorcycle cylinder head.
More details on the engine and photos can be found here;
http://www.morspeed.co.uk/intro2.htm
It's an incredible car, and for this season has had lots of trick new stuff developed for it, so it keeps on getting faster.
dhdev (Oli)
31-05-10, 10:15 AM
I think you need to get involved with some aero work too! Didn't realise it was allowed in the class!
novarally
31-05-10, 10:23 AM
I think you need to get involved with some aero work too! Didn't realise it was allowed in the class!
I have a few things planned in that direction as well.
dhdev (Oli)
31-05-10, 10:49 AM
BTW word on the grapevine is that the mini doesn't produce as much as 180bhp ;)
What aero mods do you have in mind? Have you got ''Competition downforce'' by Simon McBeath? There is a small section in the book on a Metro hillclimb car that spent some time in the wind tunnels at MIRA, makes for interesting reading.
novarally
31-05-10, 10:55 AM
BTW word on the grapevine is that the mini doesn't produce as much as 180bhp ;)
What aero mods do you have in mind? Have you got ''Competition downforce'' by Simon McBeath? There is a small section in the book on a Metro hillclimb car that spent some time in the wind tunnels at MIRA, makes for interesting reading.
The owner and driver of the car told me 180bhp, if it was me I would be under-estimating the power output, rather than telling people it was more powerful than it was!
I've known Simon McBeath for years, and I'm sure I've got that book (and all his others) in the house somewhere.
So far I have an ex-BTCC carbon fibre front splitter and undertray which I intend to adapt to fit, but I am hesitating on fitting until I decide whether or not to wide-arch it.
I've got a rear diffuser as well.
dhdev (Oli)
31-05-10, 11:14 AM
It does seem strange that he'd over quote, I'll dig deeper for more info.
The diffuser will work best in conjuction with a flat floor, the diffuser doesn't create downforce itself, it works to reduce drag and increase the effectiveness of the underfloor to produce downforce. But if you know SB, I'd tap him up for advice, rather than listen to someone who's read his book lol
Love this car, makes me miss mine though!
novaproject1
31-05-10, 11:30 AM
love it
dhdev (Oli)
31-05-10, 01:02 PM
My source tells me that the mini had a rebuild around Feb for this season and produced 165bhp on the optimistic engine dyno. Not that it makes a jot of difference as the only number that matters is the one on the timing sheet at the end of the run!
t45_ste
31-05-10, 01:02 PM
Absolutley love this car, looking forward to seeing the titanium bits. Just made a set of titanium tie bars for mine.
Did you buy the splitter from TCS? If you decide not to use and want to sell drop me an email with a price.
Ste
EDIT. What material is the exhaust made from colin?
novarally
31-05-10, 01:08 PM
Absolutley love this car, looking forward to seeing the titanium bits. Just made a set of titanium tie bars for mine.
Did you buy the splitter from TCS? If you decide not to use and want to sell drop me an email with a price.
Ste
EDIT. What material is the exhaust made from colin?
Hi Ste.
The engineering firm I'm going to see this week does titanium tie bars and anti-roll bars for Minis, so I'm also going to speak to them about making some for my Nova.
How do the weights of your titanium ones compare to standard tie bars? (that's assuming they are of similar length etc.!)
Yes, Tony at TCS sorted me out with the splitter and undertray, he has loads of them on the shelf, so we just picked out the closest to Nova sized.
As far as I know the exhaust is plain old stainless steel, no doubt an Inconel one would save a bit of weight, but at enormous cost! What are you going to be using on yours?
novarally
31-05-10, 01:10 PM
My source tells me that the mini had a rebuild around Feb for this season and produced 165bhp on the optimistic engine dyno. Not that it makes a jot of difference as the only number that matters is the one on the timing sheet at the end of the run!
Interesting, he's certainly slower than he was previously which does tend to suggest that he's down on power. I'm sure he'll find it again though....
t45_ste
31-05-10, 01:17 PM
I have yet to weigh mine but they are slightly shorter as im running them backwards so not great for comparrison purposes.
Im hoping to use titanium for my exhaust, a chap who i work with makes titanium silencers so going to tap him up for one. Titanium tubing is very expensive but may look into buying a system from another car and making it fit.
Also if you want some titanium bar to take to the engineering firm to cut the cost, i may be able to get you some ;)
your rear anti roll bar set up is going to make a diffuser tricky isnt it colin?? cant wait to see the new beam
novarally
31-05-10, 02:11 PM
I have yet to weigh mine but they are slightly shorter as im running them backwards so not great for comparrison purposes.
Im hoping to use titanium for my exhaust, a chap who i work with makes titanium silencers so going to tap him up for one. Titanium tubing is very expensive but may look into buying a system from another car and making it fit.
Also if you want some titanium bar to take to the engineering firm to cut the cost, i may be able to get you some ;)
Thanks Ste, that's appreciated.
Out of curiosity, do you know the like for like weights of titanium vs. mild steel? i.e. if the exact same item was made in each material, what would the weight difference be?
t45_ste
31-05-10, 02:17 PM
I can find out for you colin, obviously there are differant grades of both materials. I will get you some comparisons this week from the titanium we use.
novarally
31-05-10, 04:54 PM
I can find out for you colin, obviously there are differant grades of both materials. I will get you some comparisons this week from the titanium we use.
That would be great thanks. Not after perfect accuracy, just a broad brush figure e.g. titanium is roughly 50% of the weight of steel.
novarally
31-05-10, 04:55 PM
your rear anti roll bar set up is going to make a diffuser tricky isnt it colin?? cant wait to see the new beam
Yes.
I haven't explored that one yet.
djbrowney
31-05-10, 09:17 PM
cracking car colin, after seeing it today i cant help but wonder if you could fit a 16v head from a 1400 corsa to give you that little bit more.
cracking car all the same mate
nice to meet you !
novarally
31-05-10, 11:08 PM
cracking car colin, after seeing it today i cant help but wonder if you could fit a 16v head from a 1400 corsa to give you that little bit more.
cracking car all the same mate
nice to meet you !
Good to meet you as well.
The 16v head is a possibility, the big question mark is whether the very narrow bore size will give enough surface area to fit 4 valves into! This is something that we'll measure next time the head is off.
novarally
01-06-10, 06:38 PM
A few other things on the shopping list now, although they may be a long way off before I can fund them;
Titanium driveshafts
Titanium flywheel
Centrelock wheels (as far as I know never seen before on a Nova?)
t45_ste
01-06-10, 11:46 PM
Hi colin, still waiting for an answer back with regards to steel vs titanium.
Who will be making the centrelocks? Would it be x sport racing?
Has the enginereing firm whos making the parts mentioned the life span of them?
novarally
02-06-10, 08:40 AM
Hi colin, still waiting for an answer back with regards to steel vs titanium.
Who will be making the centrelocks? Would it be x sport racing?
Has the enginereing firm whos making the parts mentioned the life span of them?
No, it's not X-Sport.
I will share more details with you after I've had a chat with them, which should be today if all goes to plan.
I'm only going to go with centrelocks if it offers a weight saving. Although they would look incredible it's going to cost a lot of money, so it would have to offer a tangible benefit!
The tubed titanium driveshafts look like they will give a significant weight saving, and one assumes are stronger as well.
Crikey this is all getting a bit serious !
I do know someone who had a set of centrelock adaptors made for his Cosworth, I believe there were 5 sets made in total but as you can imagine they were not cheap at all. Personally I can't see any weight saving gains being made there even if the wheels you end up using are magnesium.
I would be looking into lower arms, hub carriers and parts liek that to save weight but like the centrelocks I can't see the weight saving being worth the cost of having something like that made.
What TCA's does the car run ?
novarally
02-06-10, 10:37 AM
Crikey this is all getting a bit serious !
I do know someone who had a set of centrelock adaptors made for his Cosworth, I believe there were 5 sets made in total but as you can imagine they were not cheap at all. Personally I can't see any weight saving gains being made there even if the wheels you end up using are magnesium.
I would be looking into lower arms, hub carriers and parts liek that to save weight but like the centrelocks I can't see the weight saving being worth the cost of having something like that made.
What TCA's does the car run ?
I did get offered some centrelock adaptors for my Escort Cosworth, but I declined them as they were heavy, and sourcing suitable wheels was a bit of a minefield as there are so many different peg drives on centrelockers.
I only considered it for this Nova as I am having some wheels made for it anyway. I will know more by the end of today.........and will update later on.
The TCA's are standard style, but modified to a rose joint on the inner chassis fixing.
I can't see there being much weight to be saved with titanium TCA's, but I think that titanium tie bars and anti-roll bars could certainly be worthwhile.
The company I am talking to are specialists in titanium machining for Mini race cars, but are happy to do one-offs for anything.
I notice on their website they also do titanium drive flanges for the hubs. Interesting.
As always, it's all down to how much you want to spend.....
Probably the same adaptors if it was a while back but I agree they are seriously heavy so would be no use for what you want, well that type anyway.
It is as you say down to costs, when a car reaches the level yours has your left with 2 options, leave it alone or go mad. Your obviously very keen on this motor so why not do a few bits and see how it works, I think my concern would be the huge costs you mention for some of the parts gaining you very little if anything on a sprint
novarally
03-06-10, 08:15 AM
Also if you want some titanium bar to take to the engineering firm to cut the cost, i may be able to get you some ;)
Ste.
I went to see the engineering firm yesterday, and have left them with a Nova rear beam to work from as a template.
He's going to get back to me with the tube sizes he is going to need, so I will let you know and hopfully you will be able to assist with obtaining the raw materials.
Apparently he makes most of his stuff out of Grade 2 titanium. To be honest he was confusing me with all the specs/Grades and different elements which get added in to the mix to make titanium alloys!
t45_ste
03-06-10, 10:35 AM
He sounds like he knows what he's on about. Iv asked the metalogist to get me the densitys of titanium v mild steel.
When you find out what exactly will be needed drop me an email. I doubt we will have much titanium tube, we mainly have bar and billets.
The firm definatley sound like they know what they are doing, and i think i may have seen some of their products in the past, they produce some very nice items.
dhdev (Oli)
03-06-10, 11:32 AM
He sounds like he knows what he's on about. Iv asked the metalogist to get me the densitys of titanium v mild steel.
When you find out what exactly will be needed drop me an email. I doubt we will have much titanium tube, we mainly have bar and billets.
The firm definatley sound like they know what they are doing, and i think i may have seen some of their products in the past, they produce some very nice items.
You'll need to get the mechanical properties of the Ti alloy being used, pure Ti is actually not as strong per unit mass as steel, so you'd see a weight increase!
novarally
03-06-10, 11:41 AM
He sounds like he knows what he's on about. Iv asked the metalogist to get me the densitys of titanium v mild steel.
When you find out what exactly will be needed drop me an email. I doubt we will have much titanium tube, we mainly have bar and billets.
The firm definatley sound like they know what they are doing, and i think i may have seen some of their products in the past, they produce some very nice items.
They've been making Mini stuff for a few years now, have a look at their website;
http://www.force-racing.co.uk/home/
that website should be in 18+, pure porn
novarally
05-06-10, 01:45 PM
He sounds like he knows what he's on about. Iv asked the metalogist to get me the densitys of titanium v mild steel.
When you find out what exactly will be needed drop me an email. I doubt we will have much titanium tube, we mainly have bar and billets.
The firm definatley sound like they know what they are doing, and i think i may have seen some of their products in the past, they produce some very nice items.
Ste.
You have e-mail!
Thanks.
Colin
BRoadGhost
05-06-10, 07:02 PM
Having seen video footage of the man behind amuse lift one of their titanium S2000 systems with one finger I'ud say well less than 50% of the weight of steel.
The system on Pepe is entirely titanium, but it was only ever built & fitted on / around the car so can't confirm it overall…
Having seen video footage of the man behind amuse lift one of their titanium S2000 systems with one finger I'ud say well less than 50% of the weight of steel.
The system on Pepe is entirely titanium, but it was only ever built & fitted on / around the car so can't confirm it overall…
The exhaust isn't structural though and most of the weight of a steel system will be to allow for some corrosion, which titanium doesn't suffer from as badly. In a structural piece, iirc your average titanium allow is about half the density of steel but not quite as stiff or strong, so it ends up at roughly 2/3rds the weight for a like to like component beefed up as necessary, obviously a component can be designed better than standard though to further improve the weight loss.
BRoadGhost
05-06-10, 07:42 PM
Yeah not sure how effective it'ud be at not being "excessively loud" for a street legal car ~ I ran just a single titanium back box last year to get it MoTed & it was an almighty F A I L [amongst other things!]
If it's for something that can't be used on the Queen's Highway then fcuk it who cares ;P
hill climbers have to pass noise tests.......colin is using titanium for structural components......
t45_ste
07-06-10, 09:58 PM
Hi Colin, sent you an email.
Heres some info about titanium, its in the email but thought it may be intresting to some folk:
Density of pure iron = 7.8 g/cm-3
Density of pure titanium = 4.5 g/cm-3
Mild steel is basically iron + a bit of carbon, which itself is less dense than iron, therefore density of m/steel is about 7.2 g/cm-3.
Aerospace Ti (what we use) is Ti6/4 which is 6% Al + 4% vanadium.
Al has a density of 2.7 g/cm-3
V has a density of 6.1 g/cm-3
Therefore the density of pure Ti that is approximatley the same as Ti 6/4 is 4.5 g/cm-3
For comparison purposes the density of water is 1 g/cm-3
Ste
novarally
29-06-10, 04:31 PM
Haven't updated for a while, but things have been happening with my Nova.
Last weekend I was at Gurston Down hillclimb with it for its first proper competitive outing (having crashed and broken the steering rack on the previous event, very early in the day!).
This time I ended up 4th in Class, up against the seriously quick Minis, but within 1.5 seconds of the Hill Record, so I was pleased with that, especially as I was using slicks that are certainly 5 years old, and quite possibly older than that.
After the event I've started a programme of modifications aimed at improving performance but without spending a lot of cash.
The rear dampers are feeling very tired, so they've been removed;
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/002-9.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/003-11.jpg
And I am having some new ones custom built, with alloy bodies and double adjustable damping. Photos to follow of those when I get them back, which will hopefully be next week.
I've also managed to lose another couple of kg's out of the car by cutting away superfluous metalwork, within the bounds of the regulations.
I don't think I'll be able to afford new tyres before the next event, so I will just have to try harder still to beat the Minis.
My plan to have a titanium rear axle built has suffered a major setback, the quote came back, and at a price of £1,675 it's a little difficult to justify right now!
thats a stunning cost..... but custom fab is costly...
what about getting more hp out of it, or is off the line traction an issue on the tyres you have?
hows the diet going??;)
novarally
29-06-10, 04:48 PM
thats a stunning cost..... but custom fab is costly...
what about getting more hp out of it, or is off the line traction an issue on the tyres you have?
hows the diet going??;)
More horsepower really isn't an option on the current engine. 985cc, standard crank, rods and pistons and 1.5 bar of boost makes it marginal already..........
My personal diet is actually having some effect, it would be a lot better if it wasn't for the Devil that is alcohol though.
my diet is working, until i get hungry, which is often
Get me to drive it? Kilos lost instantly lol
from you sh1tting or from knocking bits off????
from me being of a 'race prepared' build lol
novarally
06-07-10, 02:14 PM
The new rear dampers have now been made, and are ready to be fitted;
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/017-11.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/018-8.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/019-11.jpg
Really impressive service from Protech who made them for me, they turned them round in 4 working days from receiving my old ones, to delivering the new ones to my door! Plus being alloy bodies they are about 200g each lighter, and at a very sensible price too.
I will be back at the Gurston Down hillclimb on the 18th of July, for battle to resume with the Minis. There's a preview for the event here;
http://gurstondown.org/latest.htm
very jealous, they look the bollocks
I would love to see this car in action, do you have any videos online Colin?
I do like the look of them!
novarally
06-07-10, 07:25 PM
I would love to see this car in action, do you have any videos online Colin?
I haven't, and I'm not aware of any that have been posted up either. But there's a good chance there will be some after the next event.
scott.parker
07-07-10, 05:44 PM
They look the dogs bit mate, very nice! Must have been pricey too..
Scott
peester
07-07-10, 10:25 PM
very jealous, they look the bollocks
seconded.
I think the words i'm looking for are 'om nom nom' lol
novarally
07-07-10, 10:34 PM
They look the dogs bit mate, very nice! Must have been pricey too..
Scott
£140+VAT each. Very sensible prices for custom built stuff I would say.
That is a very good price imo! Look fapping good too!
I too would love to see vids, Great car.
scott.parker
07-07-10, 10:58 PM
Cheep in fact..
chrisnovaturbo
07-07-10, 11:09 PM
do they do fronts as well ?
was that a colin only price?
novarally
08-07-10, 08:15 AM
was that a colin only price?
No, I just rang them up and had a chat with them. I'd never dealt with them before, but several people had recommended them to me.
i got a rough price on avo coilovers to a similar spec through demontweeks and it was double that
novarally
08-07-10, 03:06 PM
i got a rough price on avo coilovers to a similar spec through demontweeks and it was double that
Yes, SPAX quoted me over £300 each to get something similar made.
Protech have been superb, really quick, and good communications as well.
discoinferno
08-07-10, 08:07 PM
i am ordering some protech to replace my avo's :)
Nice suspension, whats the exact weight of them.
I just got some Ohlins 2 ways and the rears don't weigh a bloody thing !
novarally
10-07-10, 08:09 PM
Nice suspension, whats the exact weight of them.
I just got some Ohlins 2 ways and the rears don't weigh a bloody thing !
The rear dampers (without springs) are 1.2kg each. Very light indeed.
I'm jealous of the Ohlins though, I had them on my first Escort Cosworth (ex works car), and they were awesome.
novarally
12-07-10, 07:50 PM
If anyone can make it along to the Gurston Down hillclimb (near Salisbury), I will be racing the Nova this Sunday (18th July).
I can't promise, but I might be able to wangle some free tickets, but these are in very short supply, so please don't ask unless you can DEFINITELY attend on the day.
I can also offer to deliver any Nova parts to the venue if anyone needs anything.
Angus Closier
12-07-10, 08:09 PM
Sounds good, im only about 15 miles from the hill climb! I will hopfully be there mate, just going to see if I can book the time off work!! Infact I will be there tomorrow!! Car looks good mate and will be good to see it in the flesh!!
novarally
15-07-10, 07:00 PM
Got a new seat fitted, along with a new harness.............
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/037-2.jpg
I had to fabricate some new mountings for it, as the previous seat was just mounted way too low in the car for my liking (the base of the seat was literally resting on the floorpan);
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/038-1.jpg
Also got a bit more weight cut out of the doors and the boot area, all within the letter of the regulations, of course.
djbrowney
15-07-10, 07:07 PM
i hope there ally mounts :)
I don't like the positioning of the seat belt buckle, some lad had this setup in his car and nearly lost his testicles.
True story.
novarally
15-07-10, 07:12 PM
i hope there ally mounts :)
Of course! Bit gutted about the extra weight though, as I've had to make them longer than before.
djbrowney
15-07-10, 07:14 PM
drill holes in them lol :)
djbrowney
15-07-10, 07:15 PM
you can take out the floor bar that the seat normally bolt to aswell, not need with a cage imo :)
milko96
25-07-10, 10:32 AM
How did it go on the 18th?
Just curious, how much would the car weigh without the cage in...?
novarally
25-07-10, 09:37 PM
How did it go on the 18th?
Just curious, how much would the car weigh without the cage in...?y
3rd place, so my first trophy with this car.
Unfortunately the event was cut short due to a major incident involving a 650+ bhp Mitsubishi Evo that rolled into some trees. Driver OK, fortunately.
I couldn't race the car without the roll cage, but I would say the cage is around 25-30kg.
peester
25-07-10, 09:44 PM
good result.. find any vids on youtube..?
milko96
26-07-10, 06:58 AM
y
3rd place, so my first trophy with this car.
Unfortunately the event was cut short due to a major incident involving a 650+ bhp Mitsubishi Evo that rolled into some trees. Driver OK, fortunately.
I couldn't race the car without the roll cage, but I would say the cage is around 25-30kg.
Great result!
Yeah I realise you need the cage for the regs, but was wondering how light you could get a Nova to.... looks like 550kg would be about the limit for a road car then...
novarally
26-07-10, 08:13 AM
Great result!
Yeah I realise you need the cage for the regs, but was wondering how light you could get a Nova to.... looks like 550kg would be about the limit for a road car then...
If you can build a road legal Nova to 550kg, then the drinks are on me.
you can take out the floor bar that the seat normally bolt to aswell, not need with a cage imo :)
He cant remove anything in between the wheel centres that is part of the main shell of the car.
I think Oli D's car was around 600-650kg, but he obviously had the option of removing the boot floor and replacing with ally, taking out metal from the centre of the car, his B pillars etc were holesaw'd IIRC and much less of a cage... I'd probably say your cage is more around the 35-40kg mark Colin unless it's T45.
http://www.customcages.co.uk/Rollcage/LoadRollCage.castle?manufacturer=Vauxhall&model=Nova&type=Multipoint
Cage will be the best part of 50KG if its CDS and with your extra bars.
Good result Colin!
novarally
26-07-10, 12:58 PM
http://www.customcages.co.uk/Rollcage/LoadRollCage.castle?manufacturer=Vauxhall&model=Nova&type=Multipoint
Cage will be the best part of 50KG if its CDS and with your extra bars.
Good result Colin!
Mine is T45.
milko96
26-07-10, 06:31 PM
If you can build a road legal Nova to 550kg, then the drinks are on me.
:thumb:
I was under the impression Oli's Mk2 mentioned above got down to 630kg with cage, so a non caged car would easy be under 600kg, not too far from 550kg with a little more work (and expence)...
:thumb:
I was under the impression Oli's Mk2 mentioned above got down to 630kg with cage, so a non caged car would easy be under 600kg, not too far from 550kg with a little more work (and expence)...
If you can take 50 kilos out of Oli's car with "a little work" you need to get a job in F1 lol
:thumb:
I was under the impression Oli's Mk2 mentioned above got down to 630kg with cage, so a non caged car would easy be under 600kg, not too far from 550kg with a little more work (and expence)...
no chance,oli's was like a rizla paper!
Easiest way to then loose weight is off of yourself. when you are really pushing for wieght loss
milko96
26-07-10, 07:05 PM
no chance,oli's was like a rizla paper!
630 - 50 = 580, so 30kg to lose...
I think its poss...
Anyway, I'll stop spamming Colins thread! :tard:
daz_9124
28-07-10, 06:55 PM
What a special little Nova this is - been following this thread with interest
any footage of her recent run out?
novarally
28-07-10, 07:03 PM
What a special little Nova this is - been following this thread with interest
any footage of her recent run out?
I don't know of anyone who's taken any video yet - I'd like to see some footage as well!
We've got plans for an in-car camera at the next event (12th September).
I will post an update soon with some of the things happening to the car.
dhdev (Oli)
28-07-10, 07:07 PM
Mine was down to pretty much the 600kg mark by the end. There was plenty left to be saved. 550kg is easily acheivable, just not cheap!
craig green
28-07-10, 07:44 PM
I'd love to see a few laps of a circuit from an onboard cam. Not sure a quick uphill blast would satisfy.... then again.
milko96
28-07-10, 07:51 PM
Mine was down to pretty much the 600kg mark by the end. There was plenty left to be saved. 550kg is easily acheivable, just not cheap!
Exellent! :thumb:
novarally
28-07-10, 10:22 PM
Mine was down to pretty much the 600kg mark by the end. There was plenty left to be saved. 550kg is easily acheivable, just not cheap!
Who's going to be first to do it though?
Here's my latest acquisition in the quest to try and achieve it (and with a cage in my case!);
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/0027.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/0038.jpg
dj_wudgey
28-07-10, 10:23 PM
steerin wheel is well cool mate absolutely love this car!!
someone appears to have posted to you a solid block of porn lol
novarally
28-07-10, 10:57 PM
someone appears to have posted to you a solid block of porn lol
Certainly is, a piece of art by the masters of carbon fibre, Reverie. Weighing in at just 260g as well!
I really want one of their seats, but the price tags are eye watering.
andy_mk3
28-07-10, 11:01 PM
someone appears to have posted to you a solid block of porn lol
lollol:thumb:
Nice buy, that will look the mutts nuts once fitted :)
the steering wheel is nom.
who do you trust to drill it. only got one shot!
novarally
29-07-10, 07:24 AM
the steering wheel is nom.
who do you trust to drill it. only got one shot!
Still thinking about that one!
Although it's only 3 holes to drill, and the centre point has been thoughtfully marked out by the manufacturer, so what could possibly go wrong?
i would mark it and check it like 12 times, and then drill tiny pilot holes. and if it goes tits up, they are "weight saving holes lol
dhdev (Oli)
29-07-10, 11:39 AM
Who's going to be first to do it though?
Here's my latest acquisition in the quest to try and achieve it (and with a cage in my case!);
I was definately suggesting with cage. And it's not going to be me that acheives it, seeing as I don't have one anymore lol
Steering wheel looks lovely, I'd holesaw the middle to save an extra few grams :cool:
Still thinking about that one!
Although it's only 3 holes to drill, and the centre point has been thoughtfully marked out by the manufacturer, so what could possibly go wrong?
Colin, word of warning, when drilling it wear a respirator or particle mask! Carbon fibre particles have the same effect as abestos to the lungs.
Colin, word of warning, when drilling it wear a respirator or particle mask! Carbon fibre particles have the same effect as abestos to the lungs.
and, if you're not a pro at drilling it, I would give it to someone else to start with tbh, too much money there to 'have a bash' at it
and, if you're not a pro at drilling it, I would give it to someone else to start with tbh, too much money there to 'have a bash' at it
Its piece of pish to drill TBH Mark, you have to start small though, 3mm onto 5mm then onto bigger. Next to no pressure at all (I use a pillar drill as its loads easier) & the bit will find its way through :)
Its piece of pish to drill TBH Mark, you have to start small though, 3mm onto 5mm then onto bigger. Next to no pressure at all (I use a pillar drill as its loads easier) & the bit will find its way through :)
I wouldn't like to try it on a reverie wheel though, and I've done it a few times before.
I wouldn't like to try it on a reverie wheel though, and I've done it a few times before.
Pah, its all the same stuff. Only difference is the price/shape IMHO.
The way I see it is its only the same as taking a hammer to say a £30k car.
Just been looking at their site, you'd have to be crazy to pay 160 quid for a xe plug cover
^could make one for less then that!!
I'll have a late type cam belt cover please Mike
lol lol
Ill be picking up an XE motor soon so Ill take a look at how to do things like that :thumb: (asin how the hell Im gonna be able to replicate them)
Pah, its all the same stuff. Only difference is the price/shape IMHO.
The way I see it is its only the same as taking a hammer to say a £30k car.
Price as in I can afford to throw away a tenners worth of flat sheet because it's splintered everywhere lol
Price as in I can afford to throw away a tenners worth of flat sheet because it's splintered everywhere lol
You must be drilling it wrong lol Iv enever splintered a sheet of it when drilling. Have when cutting tho :(
You must be drilling it wrong lol Iv enever splintered a sheet of it when drilling. Have when cutting tho :(
hmm, the opposite! We should swap pieces, you do the drilling I'll do the cutting lol Proper fine mini hacksaw and tape works fine, dremel does too but gets messy. Spose to use them funky little abrasive 'saws' though
novarally
29-07-10, 04:45 PM
A lot of measuring, re-measuring, templates and test pieces later, it's fitted;
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/029-1.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/030-1.jpg
cant quite see from the pic, but have you sleeved/washered those bolts? Carbon fibre doesn't like concentrated compressive stresses.
peester
29-07-10, 05:51 PM
reverie wheel?
hybridturbo
29-07-10, 06:13 PM
Yeh Colin posted the make a few pages back
Should of went for the momo millenium lol
daz_9124
29-07-10, 07:39 PM
Very Swarve Wheel Colin - Love It
novarally
04-08-10, 04:10 PM
Yet another change of seat (thank to Olly755 for this one), it's 2kg lighter than the previous seats I've had in the car, but more importantly it's a RECARO;
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/002-12.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/003-14.jpg
I have more brackets to fabricate to suit this seat, but it will be there until I can find a Reverie carbon fibre seat for sensible money.
Is that your Yellow Nova or Olly's Colin?
novarally
04-08-10, 05:19 PM
Is that your Yellow Nova or Olly's Colin?
It's mine now, I bought it off Kev on here.
And it's up for sale!
daz_9124
06-08-10, 10:05 PM
Very tidy seats!
novarally
07-08-10, 10:48 AM
I don't like the positioning of the seat belt buckle, some lad had this setup in his car and nearly lost his testicles.
True story.
Many thanks for pointing this out, I had of course got the straps mixed up, this is now corrected. Cheers.
What's wrong with the way the harness is mounted?
BRoadGhost
07-08-10, 11:42 AM
Colin I can't believe you've drilled that steering wheel wrong.
hybridturbo
07-08-10, 05:22 PM
Sent you email regarding reverie seats Colin :thumb:
Colin I can't believe you've drilled that steering wheel wrong.
Care to explain why its wrong? Bit pointless making a statement like that and not pointing out the mistake!
novarally
08-08-10, 08:03 PM
Finally managed to find a quick rack. Mind you, it meant buying a whole Nova rally car to get it! But it did have a Quaife straight cut gearbox in it as well which I wanted.
The quick rack has now been overhauled, and fitted with rose-jointed track rod ends;
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/029-2.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/030-3.jpg
The SCCR gearbox will be going off to a friend who builds these for a check over, and to swap over the LSD's.
I expect to fit the gearbox when the car has a Winter rebuild.
PHOTOS TO FOLLOW WHEN MY APPALLING INTERNET CONNECTION BEHAVES
AOL ftw lol
This IMO is one of the best threads on here, every update is interesting.
scott.parker
08-08-10, 08:57 PM
Not checked on this for a while, looks like it's come on well..
I would like to know what was wrong with the harness's as i was thinking of getting some central crotch straps to pull the lap belt part down across my waist etc..
Also whats wrong with the wheel fitment?
Look forward to the new pics.
Scott
novarally
08-08-10, 09:30 PM
AOL ftw lol
In actual fact I'm not with AOL as my Internet provider.
Because of where we live, we are too far away from the exchange for Broadband to get down the phone line.
So, as I need to have Broadband, I have to pay a fortune for a Satellite connection, as used by the military in the desert.
If they have the same problems I get, it's no wonder we're losing the war in Afghanistan........
If the weather is good, I'm lucky to see a download speed of much over 1MB. Upload is an astonishing 0.1MB, again if all is well.
But if it's cloudy, raining, windy or just not feeling like working, it can be much, much worse.
So spare a thought for me when you've got your fibre optic 50MB connections.
It's an absolute farce, living 2 miles away from one of the highest tech air bases in the UK (RAF Coningsby), but unable to get a reliable Internet connection.
In actual fact I'm not with AOL as my Internet provider.
Because of where we live, we are too far away from the exchange for Broadband to get down the phone line.
So, as I need to have Broadband, I have to pay a fortune for a Satellite connection, as used by the military in the desert.
If they have the same problems I get, it's no wonder we're losing the war in Afghanistan........
If the weather is good, I'm lucky to see a download speed of much over 1MB. Upload is an astonishing 0.1MB, again if all is well.
But if it's cloudy, raining, windy or just not feeling like working, it can be much, much worse.
So spare a thought for me when you've got your fibre optic 50MB connections.
It's an absolute farce, living 2 miles away from one of the highest tech air bases in the UK (RAF Coningsby), but unable to get a reliable Internet connection.
Checked the pricing on a 2mile long ethernet cable? lol
Fibre optic is a bit of a con as well, certain bits of it are, but most of it is not fibre optic, meaning it's like having a short stretch of autobahn with 30 limits either side, it can go bloody quick but it ends up doing 30 following the queue into the 30 zone lol
Sounds odd for sattelite connections though, they're normally stupidly good, and worth their ridiculous pricing!
novarally
08-08-10, 09:52 PM
Checked the pricing on a 2mile long ethernet cable? lol
Fibre optic is a bit of a con as well, certain bits of it are, but most of it is not fibre optic, meaning it's like having a short stretch of autobahn with 30 limits either side, it can go bloody quick but it ends up doing 30 following the queue into the 30 zone lol
Sounds odd for sattelite connections though, they're normally stupidly good, and worth their ridiculous pricing!
It's a joke, £140 a month for an unreliable and slow service. But I have absolutely no realistic alternative.
There's no mobile phone Internet coverage, or I can drive a round trip of 10 miles to the nearest pub with Wi-Fi, or a 20 mile round trip to the nearest McDonalds.
So I have no real choice, pay the £140 monthly or go back to Dial Up.
BRoadGhost
08-08-10, 09:53 PM
The drill points should be round 180°
Kev Turbo
08-08-10, 09:55 PM
are you sure you have your anntenna alligned properly
i do sat comms for a living and we dont have problems like this
Like wise the millions of sky users dont either
WHat size is your antenna?
It's a joke, £140 a month for an unreliable and slow service. But I have absolutely no realistic alternative.
There's no mobile phone Internet coverage, or I can drive a round trip of 10 miles to the nearest pub with Wi-Fi, or a 20 mile round trip to the nearest McDonalds.
So I have no real choice, pay the £140 monthly or go back to Dial Up.
My wallet just whimpered a bit lol There must be various satellite providers surely? Checked out reviews etc on some competitors? Satellite is the kinda connections IT businesses use to maintain terabyte upon gigabyte of massive servers remotely and as you say, the military... So it's hardly acceptable to be slow and cut out a lot!
novarally
08-08-10, 10:00 PM
are you sure you have your anntenna alligned properly
i do sat comms for a living and we dont have problems like this
Like wise the millions of sky users dont either
WHat size is your antenna?
Interesting. I must have had the engineers out 6 times in the year since it's been installed. They've replaced cables, and checked the alignment many times, and assure me it's all spot on.
Most of the time when I phone the Helpdesk to moan about the speed they blame it on weather issues, as apparently the satellite signal is bounced back to a hub in Turin, Italy.
Turin seems to suffer with an awful lot of bad weather.
I would guess the dish is about a metre across, maybe a bit bigger?
We have Sky as well, and that has only ever played up in really extreme weather conditions.
novarally
08-08-10, 10:03 PM
My wallet just whimpered a bit lol There must be various satellite providers surely? Checked out reviews etc on some competitors? Satellite is the kinda connections IT businesses use to maintain terabyte upon gigabyte of massive servers remotely and as you say, the military... So it's hardly acceptable to be slow and cut out a lot!
It's the installation costs which are the real killer, and I got mine installed for free by BT, after they withdrew the previous Internet service I was getting (which was done by radio signal, and was awesome - often up to 8MB).
Our sky does cut out in the rain but the dish is only on the 1st floor, floor level and it's one of the tiny ones in a right state! Although saying that since they put HD in we haven't had an issue, might have changed the dish! I haven't looked at it tbh lol
Kev Turbo
08-08-10, 10:11 PM
its is more than likely a 1.2 meter dish,
What equipment do you have your end?>
Yes weather can effect it a lot but that is not an excuse for poor service it simply wouldnt wash with our customers nor should it with you!
What speeds did they quote you?
scott.parker
08-08-10, 10:15 PM
Off topic! lol
Off topic! loland yet still interesting enough to keep reading lol
novarally
09-08-10, 07:33 AM
its is more than likely a 1.2 meter dish,
What equipment do you have your end?>
Yes weather can effect it a lot but that is not an excuse for poor service it simply wouldnt wash with our customers nor should it with you!
What speeds did they quote you?
The box in the house is a ViaSat Linkstar S2A.
To be fair to BT when they installed the system, they didn't set my expectations high for response speeds, quoting around 1MB.
The problem is that it's so inconsistent, there can be times I get 1.5MB, and others that I get 56k!
I could look at the other Satellite providers, but aside from the huge set-up costs for the initial install, they all put a 'cap' on data useage, I think the most I can get is about 6GB per month.
That is nowhere near enough for the amount I use.
The current service I get via BT is unlimited.
lol so off topic i love it.
but what would you rather have
unlimted **** use.
or capped good use?
i understand you have paid for the setup as it is now etc.
The drill points should be round 180°
hes right. look at the pictures of the old wheel. 2 bolts at the top. now its 1 bolt at the top.
unless hes put a different hub on it?
novarally
18-08-10, 03:07 PM
Just re-fitted the polycarbonate windscreen;
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/024-3.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/025-3.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/026-4.jpg
This was fitted when I first bought the car, but it was so scratched that visibility was terrible, especially in sunshine.
I decided to let my friend at a bodyshop have a go at it with a machine polisher and some special perspex polish, and the results are pretty good. Better than spending £230 on a new screen anyway!
The plastic screen saves 5kg compared with a glass one, so well worth having. You can see in the final photo the alloy brace which is required to stop the perspex bending inwards at speed!
My current car trailer is getting very long in the tooth, so I have just invested in this little baby Brian James Micro-Max. They're designed for towing Smart cars behind motorhomes, but luckily it fits the Nova absolutely perfectly (although only just!);
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/027-3.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/028-3.jpg
Nice!
Where did you get your mirror Colin?
novarally
18-08-10, 03:45 PM
Nice!
Where did you get your mirror Colin?
Thanks.
The mirror was in the car when I bought it. I've never seen another one like it, and there is no manufacturers name on it anywhere.
do you actually use the mirror? its not like they let other cars up the course at the same time is it???
^Its a nova, its for seeing what parts you are losing on the way up.
This just gets better and better everytime i see it.
Thanks.
The mirror was in the car when I bought it. I've never seen another one like it, and there is no manufacturers name on it anywhere.
Makes mental note to swipe it next time we meet then...lol
novarally
18-08-10, 04:27 PM
do you actually use the mirror? its not like they let other cars up the course at the same time is it???
It's useful when backing it into my workshop, off the trailer, and into parking spaces in busy paddocks.......there's sod all visibility behind you with the head restraints on the seat.
novarally
19-08-10, 04:37 PM
People who've followed this thread will recall that I got a quote for building a rear beam in titanium, which was going to be made to accept some lighweight KAD Mini brakes and hubs that I bought.
That plan was abandoned due to the absurd cost of making a bespoke rear beam.
So I am now looking at modifying a Nova rear axle to accept the Mini hubs.
A friend of mine has got a book which details every possible combination oif wheel bearing, so he's taken away the measurements of the Nova stub axle, and the Mini rear hub, and hopefully he can find something to match the two together.
Failing that it will be a question of machining out the hub assembly to accept whatever he can find to suit (note to self - check a Nova rear wheel bearing, just in case it miraculously fits straight in!).
I've been doing a bit of mocking up on a spare axle just to see how it will all go together;
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/031-3.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/029-4.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/032-3.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/030-5.jpg
If the right bearings can be found it should be pretty straightforward, obviously the main thing will be modifying the existing caliper bracket, or making one from scratch if that proves easier.
A Nova rear drum weighs 6.5 kg with the shoes, cylinders etc. The alloy Mini rear hub, with caliper, pads, mounting bracket is 2.5kg.
So a very useful saving of 8kg in total.
peester
19-08-10, 04:54 PM
lol, theyre just a bit sweet arent they..
http://www.trailertek.com/acatalog/Suspension_Spares.html
the stub is basically a 22mm straight shaft to suit a mini hub. maybe the old lathe could wizz the nova ones down a bit
novarally
19-08-10, 05:17 PM
http://www.trailertek.com/acatalog/Suspension_Spares.html
the stub is basically a 22mm straight shaft to suit a mini hub. maybe the old lathe could wizz the nova ones down a bit
Great idea, thanks.
Machining the stub axle has got to be a better plan than machining the hub. Plus I've already got a set of Mini wheel bearings. The magic of the Internet allowing you to bounce ideas off the World.........
I will go and take some measurements off the Nova stub axle, and hopefully it's bigger than 22mm.
the only issue you might have is getting the track correct. that mini one looks a lot narrower than the nova one...
can you do anything with the top half of the bulk head etc, i know you have things bolted to it...
drill holes?
and is it allowed in your cat
novarally
19-08-10, 06:04 PM
can you do anything with the top half of the bulk head etc, i know you have things bolted to it...
drill holes?
and is it allowed in your cat
No, no lightening holes are allowed in the bulkhead, and I can't remove any of it either.
darn it lol ill go back to the drawing board :D
novarally
19-08-10, 07:13 PM
http://www.trailertek.com/acatalog/Suspension_Spares.html
the stub is basically a 22mm straight shaft to suit a mini hub. maybe the old lathe could wizz the nova ones down a bit
The tapered part on the Nova stub axle starts off at 22.4mm, and goes up to 29mm at the back section, so it could have been made to be slimmed down to 22mm right the way along its length!
The section that the bearing sits on for a Nova is 40mm long, so I need to check that against a Mini to see how far back it needs to be machined to.
Definitely looks promising though.
craig green
19-08-10, 07:32 PM
Nice setup. It makes that that beam look like something from Steptoes yard.
Please powdercoat or make it look sexy when its being done for real.
novarally
19-08-10, 09:14 PM
Nice setup. It makes that that beam look like something from Steptoes yard.
Please powdercoat or make it look sexy when its being done for real.
Don't worry, this beam is purely a test bed, I will bolt it all to the one that's already on the car once I'm happy with everything.
The tapered part on the Nova stub axle starts off at 22.4mm, and goes up to 29mm at the back section, so it could have been made to be slimmed down to 22mm right the way along its length!
The section that the bearing sits on for a Nova is 40mm long, so I need to check that against a Mini to see how far back it needs to be machined to.
Definitely looks promising though.
when you consider the diameter of the metal & the mileage you will be doing, i don't think it would need hardening afterwards. i can't wait to see it again.. is there a list of hills you will be at this season?
Cant you make a beam from CDS?
I was considering this myself at one stage and still am If my other plan is flawed lol.
scott.parker
19-08-10, 09:42 PM
Like Austin did on his saloon??
Did he , got a link Scott?
Paul
http://www.pngclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=77587&highlight=nova+saloon
scott.parker
19-08-10, 09:54 PM
Read on from these pages for beam pics/details..
http://www.pngclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=77587&page=25&highlight=rear+beam
http://www.pngclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=77587&page=28&highlight=rear+beam
Scott
novarally
19-08-10, 09:58 PM
Cant you make a beam from CDS?
I was considering this myself at one stage and still am If my other plan is flawed lol.
I sent several messages to Austin requesting weights/details of the beam he made, but he never got back to me.
Yes, I could get one made, but I'm not sure that there is anything to be gained from it.
Once the drums and ARB are stripped off a standard Nova rear axle, there's not really a lot of weight to it. I reckon fabricating one from scratch might be more trouble than it's worth.
But if anyone thinks differently I'd be interested to hear other views.
Ive neve done it, but I really cant see it being too difficult to be fair.
novarally
19-08-10, 10:10 PM
when you consider the diameter of the metal & the mileage you will be doing, i don't think it would need hardening afterwards. i can't wait to see it again.. is there a list of hills you will be at this season?
For this season I've only got one more event lined up........Gurston Down on 12th September.
But I do plan to do at least one other event somewhere this year, so I can get another signature on my licence and get it upgraded to 'National A'.
As yet I haven't decided which event to do.
I'm planning on a fairly major Winter rebuild/improvement programme, and then a wider range of events next year (funds permitting).
fearless
19-08-10, 10:10 PM
Is IRS not an option Colin -can post a few pictures if it helps
Dave
novarally
19-08-10, 10:13 PM
Ive neve done it, but I really cant see it being too difficult to be fair.
What was your thinking behind wanting to fabricate one? Purely to save weight?
What was your thinking behind wanting to fabricate one? Purely to save weight?
Yeh for weight, do you think it would not be lighter? Also using RJ's on the car mounting points, setting the shocks in more vertical plane, can make it round a corsa whiteline ARB for example, that actually works?
Just a better design, I havent really looked into it too much, more just an idea between me and my mate down the yard.
novarally
19-08-10, 10:18 PM
Is IRS not an option Colin -can post a few pictures if it helps
Dave
No, it's not an option withiin the 'Production' regulations that I'm bound by.
The same style of suspension that it left the factory with has to be retained.
So you can't replace a MacPherson strut with a wishbone for example. You are allowed to alter the pick-up points a little (maximum 20mm IIRC), but that's it.
For this season I've only got one more event lined up........Gurston Down on 12th September.
damn... i'm going to the silverstone 1000 km that weekend
craig green
19-08-10, 10:20 PM
I think I said it before, but having a titanium beam would probably end up as heavy if not heavier getting it as stiff as the steel beam you are replacing.
Didnt you have a shell with IRS before? I'm sure you know whats involved with that setup? Maybe a Honda style setup could be grafted in at a lesser cost?
mk1nova_rich
19-08-10, 10:29 PM
I would recommend getting the stub axles hardened IMO. Do you do the turning work yourself?
djbrowney
19-08-10, 10:33 PM
There is a company in wisbech who will make any wheel bearing you need any size :) Brt bearing iirc
They wont make ones for the f28 though lol
novarally
19-08-10, 10:36 PM
I would recommend getting the stub axles hardened IMO. Do you do the turning work yourself?
My neighbour has a lathe and is a good engineer, so I'm hoping I can persuade him to assist.
But if that fails, a friend in Bournemouth is a toolmaker and I'm sure he'll work for beer. He'd be able to do the hardening as well.
mk1nova_rich
19-08-10, 10:38 PM
Shouldnt take too long to turn two stub axles. Ideally they want to be turned down to around 22.25mm, case hardened and then turned to size with a diamond tipped tool. Thats how i would do them
Shouldnt take too long to turn two stub axles. Ideally they want to be turned down to around 22.25mm, case hardened and then turned to size with a diamond tipped tool. Thats how i would do themif you know how and have the skills why dont you quote colin?
novarally
26-08-10, 01:45 PM
These have just arrived in the post - a pair of 22mm diameter Mini stub axles designed for use on trailers using Mini hubs (bargain buy - thanks to Mowgli for the link!);
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/020-9.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/021-6.jpg
They are exactly the same length as Nova ones, but having had a try with them, and some measuring, I find that the plan to machine down the Nova stub axles has been thwarted.........the Nova stub starts off at only 16mm diameter (just after the thread ends) and then tapers out to larger.
But it needs to be 22mm all the way from the thread backwards.
So, I'm now thinking that it would be possible to cut the flange part off a Nova stub axle, and weld these Mini trailer stubs onto them.
I'll need to take professional advice as to whether welded will be strong enough, but I'm sure that a weld properly done would be as strong as a solid piece of metal. That will also avoid the problem of having to get it hardened, as presumably these stub axles I've bought are already done.
The only other alternative is to completely machine new stubs from scratch.............but that will no doubt be a more expensive route.
Any expert thoughts are of course welcome.
In the meantime I decided to go back to having yellow headlamp covers, so got the paints out!;
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/007-9.jpg
discoinferno
26-08-10, 04:24 PM
really like this car , what does it go like?? is it similar to a std nova gsi?? or is it qwuicker?? what torque has it got??
looks very well engineered
mk1nova_rich
26-08-10, 04:51 PM
much lighter and more powerful than a Gsi so im guessing quite a lot quicker, combined with the handling setup and trick mods i bet the anti-lagged 1.0 turbo makes it quite nippy to say the least!
BRoadGhost
26-08-10, 05:11 PM
lol - I think the difference to this & a GSi is chalk & cheese
novarally
26-08-10, 05:29 PM
lol - I think the difference to this & a GSi is chalk & cheese
Indeed........a Power to Weight ratio of 270bhp per tonne makes it go rather well.
A quick off the top of my head calculation suggests about 117bhp per tonne for a GSi.
Not really on the same planet performance wise.
To give some idea of the performance, there was a specific Class for Ferrari's at the last hillclimb I did, and 10 of them turned out.
This Nova was faster than all but one of them.
And that one was a 430 Scuderia.
This one; http://www.zipp.co.uk/gallery/Loton-Park-2009-07-11/94+5126.jpg.html
dj_wudgey
26-08-10, 06:18 PM
Indeed........a Power to Weight ratio of 270bhp per tonne makes it go rather well.
A quick off the top of my head calculation suggests about 117bhp per tonne for a GSi.
Not really on the same planet performance wise.
To give some idea of the performance, there was a specific Class for Ferrari's at the last hillclimb I did, and 10 of them turned out.
This Nova was faster than all but one of them.
And that one was a 430 Scuderia.
This one; http://www.zipp.co.uk/gallery/Loton-Park-2009-07-11/94+5126.jpg.html
nice mate youll have to post up events you will be at as id love to pop allong and see this little beast kicking ass!!
discoinferno
26-08-10, 07:05 PM
Indeed........a Power to Weight ratio of 270bhp per tonne makes it go rather well.
A quick off the top of my head calculation suggests about 117bhp per tonne for a GSi.
Not really on the same planet performance wise.
To give some idea of the performance, there was a specific Class for Ferrari's at the last hillclimb I did, and 10 of them turned out.
This Nova was faster than all but one of them.
And that one was a 430 Scuderia.
This one; http://www.zipp.co.uk/gallery/Loton-Park-2009-07-11/94+5126.jpg.html
fair plays :)
hiow much does it weigh then?? thats an awesome power to weight for such a small capacity motor
somebody really should photograph some mk1 headlamps at 1:1 scale & make stickers.......
colin, re the welding.. as long as you get someone to make them good & straight, the joint could be no worse than whats already on a nova rear beam.. or get a sleeve machined so you can still bolt it to the 4 holes, and weld the mini stub inside it
mk1nova_rich
26-08-10, 07:15 PM
colin, re the welding.. as long as you get someone to make them good & straight, the joint could be no worse than whats already on a nova rear beam.. or get a sleeve machined so you can still bolt it to the 4 holes, and weld the mini stub inside it
i was also thinking along these lines, as it would probably be stronger and much easier to get the stub axles square to the beam :thumb:
novarally
26-08-10, 07:17 PM
somebody really should photograph some mk1 headlamps at 1:1 scale & make stickers.......
Funnily enough that's something I had thought about on many occasions.
My computer skills/equipment aren't up to it, so who wants to earn a few quid by making me some self-adhesive Mk.1 Nova headlamp stickers?
dj_wudgey
26-08-10, 07:22 PM
Funnily enough that's something I had thought about on many occasions.
My computer skills/equipment aren't up to it, so who wants to earn a few quid by making me some self-adhesive Mk.1 Nova headlamp stickers?
that will look mad when done!! id do it but im **** on pc's lol
a scanner or colour photo copier would get the pics.. then off to the print shop
novarally
01-09-10, 08:56 AM
Nova stub axles now machined to accept the Mini stubs;
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/003-16.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/004-12.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/005-13.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/004-13.jpg
Just got to do some trial fitting to make sure all is well before they're welded together.
mk1nova_rich
01-09-10, 04:46 PM
coming together nicely now Colin, what needs doing next?
novarally
01-09-10, 06:53 PM
coming together nicely now Colin, what needs doing next?
Figuring out a way of mounting the rear caliper bracket is now the priority. As you can see, the way it all mounts up doesn't make for a simple bracket;
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/005-14.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/006-15.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/007-10.jpg
The black alloy caliper bracket is the part supplied with the kit, which bolts directly onto the Mini radius arm.
Obviously there's nowhere for that to attach to on the Nova........
pikey1986
01-09-10, 10:23 PM
im sure you'll figure that bit out, some nice touches going into this, i bet you cant wait to get it done?
block of ally mounted to the threads off the 4 allen head bolts?
craig green
01-09-10, 11:20 PM
block of ally mounted to the threads off the 4 allen head bolts?
Anodised ina rancid colour to clash with the gold. Green? :roll:
hardcore rear brakes though!
BRoadGhost
02-09-10, 09:10 AM
You want to make an "n" shaped billet bracket that bolts up on the inside face of the beam upright [you'll need to buy some longer replacement bolts for stub axle] then the other side of it just requires two clearance holes for the caliper bracket studs to go through.
BRoadGhost
02-09-10, 09:16 AM
oh and maybe make the new bolts shanked :)
novarally
02-09-10, 09:58 AM
You want to make an "n" shaped billet bracket that bolts up on the inside face of the beam upright [you'll need to buy some longer replacement bolts for stub axle] then the other side of it just requires two clearance holes for the caliper bracket studs to go through.
Before the brackets get finally designed, I've got to think about the track width.
The Mini hubs make the track 40mm (approx) wider on each side of the axle, so I will certainly have to wide arch the car.
I can reduce this track increase a bit by machining the Mini stub axle further back.
But it's still going to be a lot wider at the rear than a standard Nova axle.
i love this car :) would like to go to a hill climb event, looking at the pictures in the link you posted there seem to be a real good variety of cars and bikes :)
could you redrill the holes in the original bracket to line up with the stub axle bolts, then machine the stub axle back to make the disc line up with the caliper? it would also help reduce the increased track
colin, if you shorten the stub, can't you redrill the caliper bracket to fit the beam??
Kev Turbo
02-09-10, 01:58 PM
Good progress i like the dedication to the cause.
A question.......
Is it really worth all this hassel to loose a few Kg off the car?
WIth the added problem of track width increase and potentially having to wide arch it isnt that going to add weight back on,
I know the standard setup isnt exactly brilliant but wouldnt all the money be better spent elsewere?
Tell me if im incorrect just posing a question :)
novarally
02-09-10, 02:22 PM
Good progress i like the dedication to the cause.
A question.......
Is it really worth all this hassel to loose a few Kg off the car?
WIth the added problem of track width increase and potentially having to wide arch it isnt that going to add weight back on,
I know the standard setup isnt exactly brilliant but wouldnt all the money be better spent elsewere?
Tell me if im incorrect just posing a question :)
It is a very valid question!
Yes, I think saving 8kg of unsprung weight will be worth all the effort, and I do enjoy the 'getting there' part of developing a car as well.
It's also not costing me much to do, as all the machining and welding work is being done by my neighbour who enjoys helping out. I just pay him for materials, damage to his tooling and a drink for his time.
I have been thinking about wide arching the car for a long time now, so this will now force my hand, which is no bad thing as I may never have decided otherwise. It means I will have a wide track rear beam, and still be able to use sensibly sized wheels/tyres.
surely you can negate some of the extra track by modifying the beam
if you grind off the plates from the outside of the beam and weld them on the inside (red to cyan)
this will lose you 20mm overall track,
and then with machining the mini stubs you might be able to maintain normal arches
http://img841.imageshack.us/img841/9251/beamnarrow.png
Kev Turbo
02-09-10, 02:59 PM
It is a very valid question!
Yes, I think saving 8kg of unsprung weight will be worth all the effort, and I do enjoy the 'getting there' part of developing a car as well.
It's also not costing me much to do, as all the machining and welding work is being done by my neighbour who enjoys helping out. I just pay him for materials, damage to his tooling and a drink for his time.
I have been thinking about wide arching the car for a long time now, so this will now force my hand, which is no bad thing as I may never have decided otherwise. It means I will have a wide track rear beam, and still be able to use sensibly sized wheels/tyres.
Thanks Colin,
I do not have any previous Race experience and not something i would ever go into so its nice to see and learn from guys like you who have obviously been competing for years.
Keep the updates coming. Although i rarely post i do keep and eye on a lot of projects this being one.
I would love to see some video footage of the car competing :)
I was thinking the other day that this in the shell of your old red car with the carbon bonnet would be a perfect setup!
completely off the wall comment here colin, but is there any way to mount the axle flange onto the inside of the beam with the shaft poking thru the hole.? that would move it in a heap... and if you did end up going wide arch, you could move it back out.....
tbh saving 8kg for maybe a few hundread quid is very good value.
i suspect the F1 guys spend millions to loose weight, im sure somewhere i heard befor, they spend a million to gain a second...
novarally
02-09-10, 09:11 PM
I was thinking the other day that this in the shell of your old red car with the carbon bonnet would be a perfect setup!
Hi Ben.
Yes, it would have been a very nice combination, but unfortunately it wouldn't have been legal for the 'Modified Production Class' regulations in hillclimbing.
BRoadGhost
02-09-10, 09:13 PM
But widetrack would be..?
TBH I dislike wide arched novas full stop, if it were mine I'ud reengineer heaven & earth to avoid that route.
novarally
02-09-10, 09:14 PM
completely off the wall comment here colin, but is there any way to mount the axle flange onto the inside of the beam with the shaft poking thru the hole.? that would move it in a heap... and if you did end up going wide arch, you could move it back out.....
It's another very interesting suggestion from you. I will investigate!
And the other point raised about losing the flange is a good one, although there's a lot of leverage going through that mounting plate, and I'm not sure if it would be man enough without it.
tbh saving 8kg for maybe a few hundread quid is very good value.
i suspect the F1 guys spend millions to loose weight, im sure somewhere i heard befor, they spend a million to gain a second...
If they gained an entire second spending the last million on the car it'd most likely be the most economic advance in F1 since the 80'slol
It's another very interesting suggestion from you. I will investigate!
And the other point raised about losing the flange is a good one, although there's a lot of leverage going through that mounting plate, and I'm not sure if it would be man enough without it.
you dont remove the flange altogether, you reweld it on the inside of the beam
novarally
03-09-10, 10:52 AM
Continuing from Mowgli's inspired suggestion about moving the stub axle to the inside face of the mounting, I have been experimenting;
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/040-2.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/041-2.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/042-2.jpg
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/hillclimbescort/043-1.jpg
I definitely think this is the right way to be going with it, although there are some issues to overcome, inevitably.
1. The stub axle isn't fitting flush to the mounting face at the moment, as the hole in the beam axle isn't quite big enough for it to pass through. This can easily be solved by making the hole larger, or machining a little bit off the stub axles.
2. This is the bigger problem.....you can see I've had to bend over the mounting 'tab' for the rear shock absorber, to give clearance to pass the stub axle through. This was also assisted by the fact that currently the stub axle is in 2 pieces (it hasn't been welded yet)!
I reckon that the shock absorber mounting bracket would have to be made to be removeable so that this could be achieved.
Nothing too problematic, and the upsides are that it reduces the track increase to maybe 10mm on each side, and it makes the fabrication of a caliper mounting bracket far easier, as it now has a square face to mount onto, which is also closer to the caliper.
that looks like quite a good solution.
i do watch/read this thread alot.
p.s can you not move the bracket for the suspension over abit? or is that not allowed in your rules?
good work :)
^Would still be a issue as its not all assembled yet.
Plus it would mean turreting in the rear and losing half the chassis leg.
dj_wudgey
03-09-10, 01:25 PM
Anodised ina rancid colour to clash with the gold. Green? :roll:
hardcore rear brakes though!
was going to say the same hardcore brakes for a well hardcore car!!
Colin. i have two words for you...
Motorbike brakes?
just read a project where a guy fitted some gsx 750 brakes to a small rear engined fiat. said he saved 6kg a corner.
any good to you?
for the fronts im thinking.
Kev Turbo
13-09-10, 08:11 PM
Any links to said project???
Great idea it would be interesting to see how efficient they would be as then nova is more than likely 2-3 times as much as a bike weight wise!
If they are over speced for the bike they may be ok though
Bike brakes are single thin discs like the KAD brakes Colin has afaik, my guess is the guy with the fiat fitted them to the back the same as Colin... considering you can generate enough heat to fade 236mm vented discs and some people manage to cook 256mm vented on lower quality pads, moving to what is effectively thin solid discs that are designed for a much more open cooling environment and less than quarter the weight, would be a very bad move!
mk1nova_rich
13-09-10, 08:18 PM
Any links to said project???
Great idea it would be interesting to see how efficient they would be as then nova is more than likely 2-3 times as much as a bike weight wise!
If they are over speced for the bike they may be ok though
at a guess this Nova will be around twice the weight of the bike but remember that the bike brakes are designed for stopping from speeds of 160mph+ so the extra weight of the car will probably be compensated for by the slower speeds reached on a sprint track. Its definitely worth looking into but i would imagine some rather expensive custom machined hubs will be required to suit the bike discs and hold the calipers. And then a spacer will be required between disc and wheel to give enough clearance for the calipers
As Mk999 says the cooling issues will need addressing
i wont link you. but some pics.
as you can see he has used the same thickness brake discs, and he calculated the area of pressure from the pistons on each caliper and the bike ones came in a little higher, so didnt affect the servo pressure.
and he says, the feel is alot more modern now unlike the old feeling.
IMO. it works like this, because its just a caliper pressing a pad against a disc. if you used small thin discs, then yeh there would be an issue as you mentioned
p.s note he spaced out the motorbike calipers to suit the disc.
http://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq313/ditch_digger/fiat/brakes.jpg
http://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq313/ditch_digger/fiat/frombehind.jpg
http://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq313/ditch_digger/fiat/oldandlame.jpg
http://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq313/ditch_digger/fiat/newandbadass.jpg
Ah right thought you meant the whole setup, can't see how he's saved 6kg a corner without the lighter discs tbh, he's swapped a caliper for roughly the same size caliper as far as I can see?
it was going from a 1971 sedan to a 2008 Suzuki GSX R750
and my bad, 6lbs. stupid american! (2.7kg's)
mk1nova_rich
13-09-10, 08:25 PM
Ah right thought you meant the whole setup, can't see how he's saved 6kg a corner without the lighter discs tbh, he's swapped a caliper for roughly the same size caliper as far as I can see?
+1
Must be aluminium alloy calipers then or something similar?
more then likely im sure 2008 tech is better then 1971! lol.
and still better then 1990ish that a nova is.
p.s he doesnt have any fancy brackets or custom machined hubs!
Kev Turbo
13-09-10, 10:40 PM
If it's just a calliper swap as pictured surly ap or similar do a lightweight calliper?
mk1nova_rich
13-09-10, 10:42 PM
If it's just a calliper swap as pictured surly ap or similar do a lightweight calliper?
yes but a decent second hand bike caliper will be a lot cheaper than an AP item
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Suzuki-GSXR1000-GSXR-1000-05-Left-Front-Caliper-/400059656165?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item5d2569e7e5
i think they are the ones the guy used, and at 50 quid a side thats good IMO.
the guy mentioned in the states he picked them up for under 20$ i think!
That motorbrake idea is a contender for most stupid post of the year.
5mm thick disc Bike brakes on a car lmfao
are you blind? - not 5mm thick!
http://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq313/ditch_digger/fiat/frombehind.jpg
That isnt a motorbike disc?!
i never said it was lol.
you said that 5mm discs would be a stuipd idea, (and i agree totally)
but i have said no where he would use 5mm discs
p.s does he use 5mm(ish) discs on the back?
Welsh Dan
14-09-10, 08:24 AM
It looks like a 10mm solid car disc. You can see where the caliper has been spaced out.
yeh, the guy used his original spec discs, and spaced the caliper.
works fine IMO. and saves weight.
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