Iain's 20XE Trackday Nova

Interesting, though the place for the RR day is 1hr.30min away i might think about taking the Astra for Fun!

And i wont say there's no point in the "equal" shafts, but i looked at it and thought as i had a LSD i wouldn't really benefit from it, as theres pro's cons to it, and the con i decided was that your placing another weak point in the drive train with the extra CV, and this is opening room for more play/ware etc so i decided not to go for it, just my opinion though, if you have tried it and think it's better then thats cool.

Scott

There isnt an extra cv Scott, just 4 as normal

I was meaning the fact the dummy shaft goes into the CV on the one side and then theres the other side that accepts a shaft, i just thought having the two shafts inputting into it was worse then having the CV straight from the box etc.

The dummy shaft really is just a spaced Cv tho, as the shaft is direct from the box to the cv, which means the shorter shaft meaning well movement for torque so to speak..

Scott does have a point as the extra angle on the CV will increase stress on that side, but no more than the short shaft already, with it being equal length and all. It's not a bad solution to the problem really.

Yeah not expecting miracles Scott as you say with the Quaife etc, just fancied trying it to get any possible improvements. As it's basically just 1/2 extra splined connections I'm not expecting to introduce any more weak points. :)

Good call on the new shafts as it didn't tuck into corners at all well before :P

As mentioned on the other page I was keen to get some alignment measurements and see what's what. With this in mind I bought a cheapy Gunson spirit-level-style camber gauge and a Sealey GA50 2 wheel alignment tool to play with.

So first off I set the toe on my Nova to 10 min toe out:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/519.JPG

Which according to the helpful calculator is about 1mm toe out (just over):

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/520.JPG

First up I wanted to measure bumpsteer, so I measured the available thread and wound down the platforms to simulate the springs under full compression:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/521.JPG

One Nova on its bumpstops:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/522.JPG

Measured up toe and it came back as something ridiculous like 1 degree 30 mins toe out (does this sound feasible or possible?!?!) so I definitely think thats where its skittish handling is coming from. Also checked the arms and they're looking at a bit of a funky angle!

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/523.JPG

On to camber and caster, I removed the wheels, put jacks under the lower arms/ball joints and lowered the car to its running height using some measurements I took before:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/524.JPG

Quick camber check on both sides, passenger:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/525.JPG

1.5 degrees negative camber, just what I wanted, winner!

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/526.JPG

Drivers side only shows as having 0.5 degrees neg camber for some reason though?!

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/527.JPG

Also measured the caster by turning the wheel one way 20 degrees, resetting the tool, then turning it 40 degrees to point in the other direction. This came back as 0.5 degrees positive caster on both sides which is nice, but not enough really:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/528.JPG

So measurements wise I think I'm now running:
1mm toe out
-1.5 deg camber LH side/-0.5 deg camber RH side
+0.5 deg caster

Plan is to buy some rosejointed track rod ends to invert the rods and try and reduce the bumpsteer, and maybe mod the topmount/turretss for some extra caster?

While the car was up in the air I decided to fit my new 10PSI low pressure oil switch too as I have no idea what the standard one illuminates the light at:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/529.JPG

No standard pressure switches left on the back of my engine now lol

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/530.JPG


Constructive critisism/feedback/tips welcome regarding suspension geometry as I'm new to it all, as always I'm finding the best way to learn is to dive in head first. :)

Awesome work on the toe and camber work, love how the steering arms are... You'll be amazed how long the ball joints last like that.. ;)

Having mm measurement on the tracking gauges is very handy, as min can be so hard to work out at times.

Interesting work on the suspension settings.
The standard oil switch switches at something daft like 4psi.

LOL @ the angle of the track rods, and people wonder why things wear/ break with a low car lol

BTW is that Sealey tracking setup your own or have you borrowed it?

Get a tyre pyrometer and find out what it's actually doing first, hard to adjust things when you have no idea what the tyres are actually doing. You can make educated guesses from handling traits but to really know whats going on tyre temps are key.

Sort the arms like we discussed and a lot of your steering issues will sort themselves.

Thats quite interesting mate, i like the way going about it, i might have to sift back through your thread as im going to do corsa servo/peddle mod and EPAS mod on the loon..

Cheers Ben, standard TREs will be binned soon!

Adam, yeah thought it was crazy low PSI, which is why I went for the 10PSI one (couldn't find a 15PSI one that was my first choice). Bought the camber and tracking gauges, will come in very handy in the future (already lined up 3 cars and they all drive better than they used to including the Nova that's a lot more predictable in straight lines now)

MK999 yeah that's the plan, will just go for the Compbrake setup as a bolt-on solution:
http://www.compbrake.co.uk/images/uploads/CMB0390.jpg

Sounds good Scott, Corsa stuff is loads better you won't regret it!

Nice work dude, i need a good nose arounnd this! where was the camber gauge from?

Camber gauge was from eBay member stop4tools: http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/stop4tools

Ordered! Cheers :)

MIG Club east midlands rolling road meet this morning, good turnout:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/531.JPG

Strapping the Nova down:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/532.JPG

Quick video of the runs:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmTX0wE8hKc

This video you can see it chuffing black smoke when its running rich:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPihfk0r-do

Resulting figures and graph, only 149bhp and 145ft/lb torque which was a little less than I was hoping for but oh well, equates to 180bhp/tonne. Might be time for some nice camshafts...

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/533.JPG

I love this car! Good power when you done the bottom end your self and like you said its not perfect is it still burning a bit of oil

Have you got a certain amount you want from the engine or do you just want a bit more then you already have?

The car loves you too lol Yeah its still burning oil, still to investigate if its rings/stem seals/etc though.

Honestly it does everything I want from it now engine wise, seems reliable and has great power delivery for the backroads and enough power for the straights at Donington. Never been that fussed on rolling road numbers just thought I'd attend, although seeing a number automatically makes you want to improve it!

Yer I had the same feeling when putting my nova on the rolling road (the day I brought it lol) and it churned up the immense figure of 55hp impressive stuff I know, so what's the next stage for the car throttle bodies and a cam?

Focus on the geometry and handling for now, together with the equal shafts and big block CV setup, after that might try some mild cams to use on the standard injection or build a new head if I find it's the stem seals causing oil consumption

Rolling road figures are for the pub its about how it drives

Sounds like a good plan wish I never bottled it with my own project, the hicomp piston you used were they pocketed then?

Yes larger valve pockets than standard I think.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nova_stee

Rolling road figures are for the pub its about how it drives

---

Totally agree as out in the real world they are just figures and handling, car weight and driver ability have a lot more to do with it then just pure hp.

Iain, that figure is a good readout and more then likely a real one! so it's better to know what the engine is doing rather then go to place that tell you what they "think you want to hear"

If you really want to improve power/torque and drivable i would 100% say get a Newman/cat cam set for fast road track that you dont need solid lifters for or pocketed pistons, and then to get the most of them mate you need the adjustable verniers, then the best thing you would ever buy/fit after would be a TB kit mate, you wouldn't regret it, just try to remember mine, wish i could of took you out in for a good run.

Scott

After the suspension being set up more power has to be the only real option other then selling it to me with a good installment plan lol

Id be more than happy with that lemonel, its going to be what, nineteen years old at the youngest, and its making absolutely bang on factory power, as Scott has said i would be willing to bet money on that being a genuine reading aswell rather than some of the figures others have seen from standard xe's before on here!

We always want a little more than we already have so id reckon cams and a chipped ecu may be the next step, keep it on factory injection and a couple more ponies out and maybe improve the torque figure a bit more:thumb:

ITBs are long term plan Scott but not for this year! Cams sound likely though.

Spud yeah it's a 1989 engine, rebore/hone/rings/pistons/regrind/lapped in valves etc should be making it an almost new engine though? lol I suppose it could have been 130-140 so I should be happy!

Well thats perfect for a 23 year old engine, shows youve done a cracking job mate, well done:d

It aint 23yrs old though if its been rebuilt?

Anyways,
Not a bad result Iain if its still got its oil issue's. Good to see an accurate sounding RR for once too.
Is it worth sticking some "road" cams in though? Personally, no. Especially if you're happy with how it goes.

Save for the bodies and then get some decent cams in there with them.... :cool:

Nice real result Lion

imo you filter wont be doing you any favours, thats probably where the wavey torque and slightly lower power is happening. c20xe's love the standard box and a better panel filter. a friend of mine had a mk2 astra gte that had a k&n panel filter, stainless system and "chip" that was 160bhp

Nice work lemonel! :)

Cheers all. Burgo if I'd thought about it on the day I could have tried removing the filter for another run, oh well.

Small update so here's some pics of the new rims on the daily:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/BMWWIP/013.JPG

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/BMWWIP/014.JPG

Now onto the Nova lol This weekends plan is to tickle the turret slightly to take the topmount from this:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/534.JPG

To something that'll allow nearer this:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/535.JPG

I have no idea how much extra caster this will give me but it can only help?!

There's mud on the sill.

Thanks for your kind words.

Hack hack hack lol

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/536.JPG

Chop chop chop:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/537.JPG

Finished, neatened and painted up again:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/538.JPG

How the turrets look in the bay now:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/539.JPG

Slight angle on the strut is a good sign something has changed:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/540.JPG

And if my gauge readings are anything to go by I'm now running 2 degrees +ve caster on both wheels:

http://iainel.co.uk/images/forums/NovaWIP2a/541.JPG

Old mesaurements were 0.5 deg caster, so a huge improvement there. Camber is now at 1 deg LH and 0.75 deg (45 mins?) RH, a little less than before. I have the ability to twist the topmounts for more camber and retain some extra caster if I choose to though.

Dude do as i did, get the top mounts and have the "nipple" part machined/turned down by around 3-4mm less, i got more play that way without enlarging my turret holes, so if you do that as well now you'll have LOADS of movement!