1.6 8v engine tuning ???????????

[benny f gsi,n it]

hey i just wana get some veiws on the best tuning mods for a 1.6 8v gsi engine, i dont mind spending enough to get what i want :) . engine has already got :
ashley 4 branch and full system.
piper cam (no vernier tho).
fse valve.
k&n.
can anyone else recomend some good modifications i was considering head work lightnd fly wheel ect ect?

[Geth]

Ditch the injection system and fit some DCOE 40s. That would allow you to go for a lairy cam with out ****ing up the injection system. A Blydenstein B+ head will make a huge difference too, and make sure your ports are matched to the inlet and exhaust manifolds.

[Dan]

use the search function and all your dreams will come true lol :thumb:

[benny f gsi,n it]

i have didnt really come up with what i wanted. yer was considering a nice set of t40s but finding a good clean set is hard. ok i will have to get in contact with blydenstein for a head. dan what are you running on yours may i ask?

[Stuart]

get a DTA and have that mapped for your setup..... its proven that you CAN get t40 peformance from the 1600 mpi setup... might need to change injectors and fit a REAL fuel pressure reg (ie throw the fse in the bin)

[Dan]

http://www.novaload.net/forum/viewfeaturecar.php?ref=2011

Thats the feature page for my car with the specs.

[Adam]

If you've got the cash forget t40s as said above.
Efi with proper management gives MORE power than carbs, and is the way to go.

[benny f gsi,n it]

ok what do you mean when you say efi and dta? and whats involved in that set up?

[Stuart]

you buy a dta ecu (base spec one will do aslong as its not ignition only), make (or get someone to make you one) a loom for the engine -> dta. get it mapped. et voilllla infinately tuneable engine with a laptop. + the DTA will lose about ?50 over ohhhh 4 years and its transferrable to other cars with a new loom. Good vfm imho

[benny f gsi,n it]

ok and where can you get a programable ecu and engine loom dta?

[Adam]

Ebay/A DTA dealer

Costly tho, about ?500/?600 for just the ECU.

[benny f gsi,n it]

ok well wouldnt it be cheaper to buy and set up a set of t40s for the same amount of power instead of keepin the mpi and using a mapable ecu?
Ben

[womble sri]

carbs sound cool too mind you i have never seena real tuned up mpi 1600

[sulphur]

Similar question, thought I'd ask here rather than start a smiliar thread.

I'm thinkin' about working towards gettin' a turbo conversion for my Gsi, after I sort out the rust etc. I'm thinkin c20xe's are too common so want something different.

Only thing putting me off it the price that courtenay want for the conversion, ?3195. I'm not bloody payin' that.
But there is a kit on Mvaux for just over ?600, but doesn't provide everything needed.
'Cos i'm new to this, what else would I need that's not provided in the kit, and what power would I be able to achieve after turbo'ing it. 150bhp once completed, but what would I be able to push it too?

Any opinions appreciated.

Cheers fellas :thumb: :D

[benny f gsi,n it]

if your new i woudl recomend non tread jacking thanks! and yer a nicley tuned up standard looking gsi engine would be great thats what im aming for really!

[Stuart]

ok well wouldnt it be cheaper to buy and set up a set of t40s for the same amount of power instead of keepin the mpi and using a mapable ecu?
Ben


swings and roundabouts..... carbs (in good nick) are gonna be ohhh ?250 + an inlet for say ?100 and all the alternator moving to suit + setup (which isnt a ?50 job!!!!!)
add in the ign setup from a 1400 carbed nova (ok not mega cash but hey)
+ carb fitting "kit" thakery washers etc... i wouldnt be surprised if its all approx ?800 once setup.


dta = ohh ?500 Loom = ?80ish + some time to make it yourself, its not hard mapping = not a massive ammount if you get a good base map.

technically its the same cost as carbs (imo) but you can sell "more" back at the end (or move it to your next toy for minimal cost, and can run a turbo if you so desire)


not saying dta (or anyother ecu for that matter as your best finding out what your local rr can map as they can get the best from it then) is the only way but it will give you some damn fine results that are pretty much identicle to that of a carbed route.

I love carbs, but appreciate modern technology too lol

[Jim]

if your new i woudl recomend non tread jacking thanks! and yer a nicley tuned up standard looking gsi engine would be great thats what im aming for really!
Actually I think his post is far from thread jacking. Turboing the 1.6 is an option you didn't think about in your post, so you should actually thank him for bringing it to your attention.

The first thing you should both consider is getting a strong bottom end. I'm running a 1.6 8v on twin 40's but spent a grand on making sure the bottom end is strong enough to take the power increase. The 8v engines are pretty much bomb proof, so they have excellent tuning potential.

I've been in both twin 40 and DTA versions. No questions that the twin 40's sound ace, perhaps I'm being biased, but the noise is addicitive. The DTA setup is mightly impressive though. You still get a nice throaty roar and the performance can match that of twin 40's plus you have much more flexibility by being able to stick a laptop on it to tune it.

You'll need management with the turbo setup and the power delivery will be different to the N/A setups, but you'll be able to squeeze more bhp with this setup as long as the internals can take it.

As Dan has proved you don't need anything more than 140bhp to have an awesome small block Nova. If you sort out the way the power is delivered and match it to a well set up Nova you'll have a car that can keep up with the big blocks and surprise a lot of far more expensive cars!

[sulphur]

So what exactly did you get done to the bottom on end to ensure its strength? With the proper set up, you reckon the standard power output of the turbo conversion would provide satisfactory performance, in comparison to the c20xe conversion?

[Stuart]

dan and jims engines give happily comprable performance to an XE so a 1600T would be "better" (assuming its not a laggy whore to drive)

lots of searches will bring up my views on a 1600 8v turbo setup (and also searches will reveal a strong bottom end guid, as will looking at jim and dans features, but for turbo use you want lower CR)

[Adam]

ok well wouldnt it be cheaper to buy and set up a set of t40s for the same amount of power instead of keepin the mpi and using a mapable ecu?
Ben
About the same tbh.
But efi will always give better results.

With a properly built turbo motor no doubt you could see a 100% power increase.

[benny f gsi,n it]

ok looks like i will start saving for a nice programbale ecu and new engine loom, is it best to strenghten bottom end first before starting uping the power rate?

[tom_beverley]

Yes, I'd say so. Depends on the power you are aiming for though and condition of your block (ie most standard 8v blocks could do with a refresh anyway due to wear and tear).

[benny f gsi,n it]

ok so what you takin about bottom end : balanced crank, lightend fly wheel, new big end shells, new arp bolts ect ect.

[Geth]

Sounds about right. Get the crank reground and some new shells fitted. ARP bolts are a must. Balanced and lightened bottom end will definately make it accelarate quicker but won't add extra strength. Might be an idea to get it all shot peened too but I believe that might mean new pistons too as a lot of garages won't guaruntee being able to get them off the rods in one piece.

[sulphur]

Got this from MiG last night, in reference to my c16se turbo question, might help you with your bottom end rebuild. Hope it does mate.
Bottom end only posted:

" This is "ideal" spec
full bottom end rebuild comprisong of:
deseamed and shot peened std rods (or steels if you can find them cheap)
ARP rob bolts
Crank inspection and work done accordingly (polish/grind etc)
Line bore the crank bearings, then have the bores done to suit the line boring. and have the block faced accordingly too.
lower compression pistons
new rings.
maybe oil squirters from the mains (not vital maybe?) "


Hope that helps, although it was posted for a turbo conversion...maybe gives some pointers. :)

[benny f gsi,n it]

ok all good points to note i rember about de-seaming the con rods for strenght

[Stuart]

dosent "add strength" persay..... it removes weakness areas....

Lots of info on here for bottom end rebuilds etc

[benny f gsi,n it]

ok cool well im gonna get on the fone after the bank holiday and 1st is a ported and polished head and vernier then gonna get a new loom and ecu. and then sorting out the bottom end.

[benny f gsi,n it]

just seen on ebay a nova bosch ecu with a superchip is this classed as a tunable ecu?

[Adam]

No

[benny f gsi,n it]

ohhhhhhhh ok pass on that 1 then