Bosch OR Seimens? (E16SE)

[Mike]

just purchased burgo's chipped bosch ECU for a E16SE engine, however my current ECU is a seimens one?

Any one know if i can even use this on a dizzy 1.6 GTE engine? Else its a trip out to have the chip swapped over lol

[Mike]

anyone?

[Mike]

looks like ill be answering my own qeustion when it arrives then

[Voodoo]

You can't use the Bosch ECU on a Siemens loom. You'll have to swap (at least) the loom, dizzy and coil. And I don't think you can swap the chip to a Siemens ECU either.
This all applies if your engine is a E16SE. If it's a C16SE it's a whole different ball game...

[Mike]

ive got a E16SE engine, with a seimens ECU BUT a bosch loom?

the ECU on its way to me IS a bosch item

[craig green]

Voodoo is right. I was under the belief that there should be a chipped AFM to go with it?

I'm not just assuming that from the HH grp A stuff either. I think Ive got an AFM that I was told is chipped in the shed.

[Mike]

Voodoo is right. I was under the belief that there should be a chipped AFM to go with it?

I'm not just assuming that from the HH grp A stuff either. I think Ive got an AFM that I was told is chipped in the shed.

if it is "chipped" and you want to sell it, ill buy it. However, would the bosch ecu work with a bosch loom?

as ive now got both a bosch ecu and a siemens ecu, BUT a bosch loom?

[craig green]

Bosch loom plug to ECU has fewer pins IIRC.

I think the Bosch setup has 1 less sensors & 2 pin plug on dizzy not 3. Siemens is oil temp sensor / Bosch has oil temp switch.

be interesting to know what other differences are.

[Mike]

tbh, ill try it anyway as what really can go wrong, not much besides burning the electrics out

also, my loom is bosch, however the ECU is seimens, personally i think ive got the wrong ecu for the loom anyawy?

[burgo]

no such thing as a chipped afm, just a fettled one

[Adam]

The afm controls the fuel system tho.
The ecu on the bulkhead only controls ignition iirc.

[Mike]

so if LLTN is correct, then id imagine it would/could work? providing the said engine IS NOT a dis-pack (E16SE)

[burgo]

the afm meter only works ot how much air is entering the engine and also at what temperature, it then sends this info to th ecu which then works out how much fuel it needs

[Adam]

the afm meter only works ot how much air is entering the engine and also at what temperature, it then sends this info to th ecu which then works out how much fuel it needs
Nah, sorry burgo.
On these engines half the ecu is on the b/head, and half is with the afm.
Why do you think the afm has about 15ish wires.
Just an "normal" afm has about 3/4 wires. ;)

[Mike]

so whats the general concensus? would it work? have i presently got the wrong ecu, right loom (or vice verser) etv etc

[Adam]

Hmm.
You need a bosch loom for a bosch ecu.
Theres a few sensor differences.
Do you know what ecu the engine came with originally? If bosch, same as the new ecu should be fine.

[Mike]

well, the engine was supplied with a Siemens ECU BUT a Bosch Loom!!

[Voodoo]

Does the car work right now? If it does, the ecu/loom are correct. You can't plug a siemens ecu in a bosch plug or vice versa, they are phisically incompatable. So, if the ecu you have now says siemens, no, a bosch ecu won't work.
Wy do you say your loom is bosch?

[Adam]

As voodoo said.
If it plugs in, its the right loom.

[Mike]

at the minute, the car is not fully wired in so will not work at all

I have in my possesion a Seimens ECU
The Loom has a bosch Tag/sticker thing on it
On its way is a Bosch ECU

HOWEVER, the Seimens ECU DOES plug into the Bosh Loom

[Voodoo]

Well, if it plugs in, it means the loom may be built by bosch, but to plug into the siemens ecu.
You'll have to get a bosch loom, with a smaller ecu plug. What about the rest of the hardware? Is the coil round or square? And the dizzy cap, attached by screws or clips?

[Mike]

i have no coil at present, i need to get hold of one

the dizzy cap is attached by 2 screws (black dizzy cap)

both the AFM plug & the ECU plug have Bosch Logo's on??

[burgo]

black cap is lucas and therefore siemans i beleave. i have a full bosch set up if you need one altho you would need a dizzy as mine is fooked. the rest is brand new tho

[Voodoo]

Hmmm... then it's a siemens car, no doubt about it.
You have to see if the it's worth swapping everything just to fit a chipped ecu...
Mind you, I heard chips for siemens ecu are rare or non existant. Maybe someone knows best.

[Mike]

black cap is lucas and therefore siemans i beleave. i have a full bosch set up if you need one altho you would need a dizzy as mine is fooked. the rest is brand new tho

what dizzy would i need Burgo? the brown capped one?

[burgo]

yes, on mine te hall sensors inside have gone tits up

[Mike]

yes, on mine te hall sensors inside have gone tits up

how much would you want then for your Loom? and would i need to change the AFM to a Seimens or are they all the same?

[Adam]

I have a few spi dizzys knocking about(3pin) same as e16se iirc. Got black type, and red/brown.

[craig green]

at the minute, the car is not fully wired in so will not work at all

I have in my possesion a Seimens ECU
The Loom has a bosch Tag/sticker thing on it
On its way is a Bosch ECU

HOWEVER, the Seimens ECU DOES plug into the Bosh Loom

Both the systems are Bosch L3.1 Jetronic. I would imagine there was some kind of update when the Siemens ECU was introduced. The AFm's both look the same (Bosch) & most of the rest of the system looks & works the same, perhaps Siemens were a cheaper supplier for Vauxhall for the ECU's?

As it says, Siemens ECU are not known for being chipped, they have the Black type (screw on) dizzy cap & square type coils. The loom will still have Bosch stickers on it.

Ive got a brand new square type coil in the shed btw.

[Mike]

I have a few spi dizzys knocking about(3pin) same as e16se iirc. Got black type, and red/brown.

need the red an brown to run this, its all thats stopping me getting it all working now

p.s. Burgo ecu arrived today mate thanks :thumb:

[Adam]

Are you sure the dizzys are different?
I have both black and red dizzys, and both have the same plug on.
3pin, hall sensor.

[craig green]

They do vary. I'd make sure the dizzy you have came from a GTE/GSi.

How many pins on the ECU loom plug is the important thing?

[nyabinghi]

Hi english friends!!
i have a nova GSi with siemens ECU and a lucas dizzy.
It was running good and had a rev limiter at 6800tr/min.

Since the lucas dissy is out of use I replaced it by a brand new BOSCH dizzy (le lucas one is no longer available) It works fine and seems better than the lucas but now their is no rev limiter!!

[Mike]

so your saying that potentially i could just change the ECU, loom & Coil and leave the dizzy then?

[nyabinghi]

yes the dizzys seems to be "compatible" but you can just have a rev limiter problem

[Adam]

I've used both lucas and bosch dizzy's on my old spi engine, ok not a e16se, but same thing. If they both have the same connection plug i'd say it would work.

[Mike]

yes the dizzys seems to be "compatible" but you can just have a rev limiter problem

doesnt bother me if it has a rev limit or not tbh