Corsa pedal box into nova [Archive] - Performance Nova Group

dhdev (Oli)

21-12-05, 10:38 AM

Hi, I'm going to fit a corsa servo/master cylinder/pedal assembly to my nova. Two main reasons, reduced weight through removal of transfer bar etc, and better pedal feel again through removing the transfer bar and hence mechanical losses arising from it.

I believe Austins nova had one fitted and I think the angry turbo nova also used one. I realise its a DIY, suck-it-and-see job but if anyone knows of any obvious pitfalls or problems that may arise I'd appreciate their comments.

Cheers.

Stuart

21-12-05, 11:48 AM

move the battery ;) lol

dhdev (Oli)

21-12-05, 11:54 AM

Are you sure, can't i just duck tape it to the top of the battery :roll:

Stuart

21-12-05, 11:56 AM

jsut get 4 syringes and use those as M/S's

i think ste had one fitted (i say fitted, i mean he sut a hole and took some pics before claiming he was god of all things nova)

i dont think there are any major pitfalls, jsut make sure you get the pedal setup thats in there at the mo beefed up as i cut mine about and it turned into a goey mess :(

Rick Draper

21-12-05, 12:47 PM

Think Ste said the pedal would need extending to line up with the other pedals. Dunno though.

loggyboy

21-12-05, 01:04 PM

This is something il be exploring the possiblity of in the near future - for same reasons as ur self.
ive seen it done else where too - but cant for the life of me think where.

fearless

21-12-05, 08:18 PM

Sorry - can't be much help other than these 2 pictures i took back in 2003 at Billing

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v516/fearlessmotorsport/4b36d464.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v516/fearlessmotorsport/Billing_2003002.jpg

Dave

dhdev (Oli)

22-12-05, 08:03 AM

Cheers for the pics dave. I lined it up last night and looks like its gonna be fairly straight forward. I think the clutch pedal will be more hassle :?

Jon_nova1

22-12-05, 09:00 AM

and youd have the brake lines of the corsa too?

what about the vacuum hose?

as for the clutch pedal being a pain, a large hammer fixes everything :D

Actually can someone just tell me the whole process, i aint got a vlue but sounds a good idea :d

loggyboy

22-12-05, 10:01 AM

Brake lines will just need to be moved to meet the new Master Cylinder.
Vacum line can easily be mated up, just a matter of moving the pipe.

craig green

19-03-06, 05:29 PM

Is there any more gen on the pedal assembly when mating up to the Corsa servo?

Anyone finished this yet?

craig green

16-05-06, 12:32 PM

bump

NovaNeil

16-05-06, 06:37 PM

Ha ha, I now own the engine in the above pics :D and the pictures I was going to post for you Craig are virtually the same as those Fearless has posted.

As soon as I receive my new Corsa Servo i'll start fitting so i'll post the progress.

Like I said in the previous thread, the ower of that car said you have to change the length of the arm going down to the pedal (he just cut and rewelded his). Apart from that it shouldn't be too hard apart from re-routing the brake lines etc.

Neil

Phil GTE

16-05-06, 06:58 PM

its 'quite' an easy mod

remove nova brake pedal from cage
Cut the hole
slide in corsa item
the corsa pedal needs to be cut and raised in line with the previous pedal
new brake lines need to be run
could use the corsa vacum line, or extend / custom make your own.
relocate battery

job done

like it was made to go in there

http://www.nova16xe.co.uk/novawip/may/DSC00181.JPG

craig green

16-05-06, 07:22 PM

That dosent look very 'Corsa like' Phil.

Thats remote reservoirs Yeah?? No servo-assistance?

CG

dhdev (Oli)

16-05-06, 07:24 PM

Heres where I'm upto at the moment.

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e296/dhdev/WorkinProgress003.jpg

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e296/dhdev/WorkinProgress007.jpg

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e296/dhdev/WorkinProgress008.jpg

I do like that bias pedal box tho! How much did it set you back, cos HH want 185 plus the cost of the cylinders!

Phil GTE

16-05-06, 08:03 PM

It was the standard item (and fitted perfectly in the gap perfectly).......

http://www.nova16xe.co.uk/novawip/New%20(15).jpg

......but the pedal box item came up on eBay, ?160ish and I couldn't resist.

bolts straight onto the standard pedal assembly - but is much shorter. Have heard that in some cases the bonnet 'just' touches.

Have a look at my WIP, its all there.

http://forums.roybacer.net/index.php?showtopic=5290&st=0

nathan.

28-05-06, 12:52 PM

These pics may help

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v613/nathan1600/pe.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v613/nathan1600/pe.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v613/nathan1600/pe2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v613/nathan1600/pe1.jpg

craig green

04-10-06, 06:04 PM

bump
Can anyone that has done this, fill me in on what happens with the brake lines? 2 outlets from the M/C need to be split 4 ways & the bias to the rear needs to be controlled somehow.

CG

Stuart

04-10-06, 06:13 PM

craig, your a clever (well it seemd so) bloke. isnt it kinda obvious lol

you need to split the fronts with a simple T piece and the rears can go back on one line (with an inline Tilton restrictor (or even a simple vauxhall fixed rate) then split at the back...

craig green

05-10-06, 09:25 AM

Ive kinda thought of that Stu but Ive never really played with brakes before & I dont want to waste good money spending on bits I later find I dont need.

I'd like to try & get it right first off. Reading your suggestion has made it sound more obvious however...

Stuart

05-10-06, 09:34 AM

just draw what you "think" you need on paper. then go to a half decent autofactors that bo brake fittings etc and ask for the bits to make the system you design ;)

loggyboy

05-10-06, 01:52 PM

sure the corsa has 2 oulets as its intended to use with abs - which means a non abs corsa M/C will have 4 outlets like a nova?

mikey14sr

05-10-06, 02:37 PM

sure the corsa has 2 oulets as its intended to use with abs - which means a non abs corsa M/C will have 4 outlets like a nova?

Thats exactly what I was thinking, a non ABS m/c is what you need.

Stuart

05-10-06, 02:42 PM

you dont "need" a non abs master cylinder. it jsut menas you have to think about things a little if you do have an abs MC....... but hey i guess people on here cant think outside the box huh lol

mikey14sr

05-10-06, 02:48 PM

Comments like that are the reason I don't post on here as much as I used to, why make things harder than they need to be, when the obviuos solution is stupidly easy?

Stuart

05-10-06, 02:52 PM

maybe the availability of non abs corsa master cylinders isnt too good? why make a task take twice as long and cost twice as much (as an example) when you can ahve a perfectly good answer (infact better with an adjustable rear bias) nearly instantly....

i posted a reply like that as ive notice people just want the easiest solution while making no effort and not willing to give maybe a differnt but equally easy answer a go without someone else doing it first... aka lazy feckers lol.

Timmy

07-10-06, 03:02 PM

so what age model of corsa seveo is needed? saw a#some in local scrapy may go back and get one if its the right one

craig green

07-10-06, 06:59 PM

My Servo is from a GSi (M I think), abs equipped no doubt. You need the servo/mc & the pedal bolts to the underneath.

Another reason why I was sceptical about the 2 outlets as opposed to 4 was if you say; run 2 fr calipers (v6) from one outlet, will that mean that more pressure runs to the rear because the slave cyl is so much smaller in the rear calipers? I know you should be able to dial that out with an adustable bias valve.

Another concern was not having a diagonal brake split. Will this cause any issues? MOT maybe??

Pretty sure Ive got it sussed now anyway, just need to do as Stu said & get myself to a factors to get all the fittings & buy some braided lines as I sold mine when I was going to break it.

Timmy

07-10-06, 08:46 PM

are thery different then say a merit and a gsi servo? will have non abs make life easyer fitting ?if they did one

pul16v

07-10-06, 10:04 PM

got mine from a 5 door 1.2 no abs and it has 2 outlets

phil

alistairolsen

07-10-06, 10:20 PM

afaik all corsas have 2 outles. The non abs models have a distribution block on the bulkhead linking the pipes cos the pump isnt there

craig green

08-10-06, 02:23 PM

My useless local dealers parts dept couldnt even find me the distribution thingy on the parts locator. I'm certain I'll use 'T' peices & an adjustable bias valve.

mikey14sr

08-10-06, 04:08 PM

I've got to hold my hands up and say sorry here guys, just had a good look at the old epc and only LHD corsa's have a 4 outlet M/C. All RHD have a twin outlet, with a distribution block, two pipes in four pipes out, Part No. 90473245

08-10-06, 05:49 PM

i'm using the nova cylinder - easy

pul16v

08-10-06, 07:33 PM

fitted to the corsa servo in the battery tray ??

you may have trouble filling it with fluid as the lid will be on its side if you use a nova one because the nova is suposed to be layed down not stoock upward

unless the corsa fluid holder fits to the nova mc which i dont think it will

phil

Novasport

08-10-06, 09:56 PM

I would stick with the original if I were you, if the 4 oulet one fit I am sure Vauxhall would have fitted it.
I wouldn't be willing to risk using a horizontal mounted master cyl in a vertical fitment! You dont mess about with brakes!

craig green

09-10-06, 12:57 PM

Good advice.
Mine should be fitted tonight all being well.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c323/turbocraig/NovaGSi-WIP_pics/tankservo003.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c323/turbocraig/NovaGSi-WIP_pics/tankservo004.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c323/turbocraig/NovaGSi-WIP_pics/tankservo006.jpg

Anyone know the bore size of a GTE/GSi master cylinder & for a base model Corsa B?

Stuart

09-10-06, 01:07 PM

ok the "feel" might be better with the removal of the bar, but if the MC is stall small bore like the std nova one then your not going to gain much extra effort at the calipers....

craig green

09-10-06, 01:13 PM

GSi Corsa m/c is 20mm bore.

What are the others, anyone?

dhdev (Oli)

09-10-06, 01:15 PM

ok the "feel" might be better with the removal of the bar, but if the MC is stall small bore like the std nova one then your not going to gain much extra effort at the calipers....

Smaller the bore at the M/cyl the greater the pressure (for a given pedal effort), hence greater effort at the caliper :p

weight saving and feel, as u say are the main advantages.

The disadvantage is you have ****e braking power due to the massively reduced pedal lever ratio and then have to go and order some 4pot calipers with massive pots to get a better hydraulic lever ratio going on :mad:

craig green

09-10-06, 01:27 PM

not quite. A bigger slave cylinder (caliper) will result in a loss of pressure when used with the same master cylinder.

If you decrease the M/c then you will get a lower resultant pressure at the slave cylinder again.

So technically fitting V6 calipers with a potentially smaller M/C will create a vague & spongy feeling pedal, I would expect.

Stuart

09-10-06, 03:02 PM

yes the pressure goes up, but you also need flow which a small MC cant deliver unless you fit the pressure reserviors so the pedal effort only goes into pushing the pads and not "filling the system"

dhdev (Oli)

09-10-06, 04:49 PM

If you decrease the M/c then you will get a lower resultant pressure at the slave cylinder again.

Not quite right back at ya :p .

The system pressure is determined by the pedal effort (hence pushrod effort/load) divided by the M/cyl area, (as Pressure=force/area). therefore reducing M/cyl bore size will increase system pressure.

the downside is that with the reduction in bore size you are therefore moving less fluid, so therefore to move the slave cylinder (caliper) by the same amount you need more pedal travel. (you get nothing for free in this life!)

To increase braking force without increasing either pedal effort or travel you must look at increasing the mu of the pads or the effective radius (disc size). :thumb:

craig green

09-10-06, 05:23 PM

Sod it. Ive just fitted the brakes from a austin princess! LOL

Stuart

09-10-06, 05:51 PM

so why arent MC's 1mm in diameter with a 200mm push then? lol

dhdev (Oli)

09-10-06, 06:19 PM

so why arent MC's 1mm in diameter with a 200mm push then? lol

Alright smarty pants :p

Packaging restrictions, machinabilty, seal performance the list goes on. It's finding a balance between travel and load thats acceptable.
Hell, I think they should insist you can't drive a car unless you have legs like Arnie, it'd make my job a damn site easier, wouldn't have to make a system that satisfies Maureen the 90yr old pensioner that drives at 80km/h with a failed servo then. lol lol

Stuart

09-10-06, 06:35 PM

;)

craig green

09-10-06, 07:29 PM

This has actrually managed to be a good informative thread from a few angles now.

Cheers guys. wheres the beer smiley?

Stuart

09-10-06, 07:41 PM

this isnt mig you know :p

09-10-06, 09:20 PM

Novasport

09-10-06, 09:46 PM

So what are we saying is the best combination of parts?

09-10-06, 10:53 PM

corsa pedal and servo, nova gte cylinder

Stuart

10-10-06, 09:08 AM

depends how you want to route/control the brake lines.... if you want adjustable bias for the rear then id say corsa MC with bias valve for the rear lines. if you want to reroute the nova lines then fit a nova MC....

simple really lol