View Full Version : Vernier Pulleys the truth
So i heard this thing right yeh:
Blue is for Torque
Red is for Power
So has anyone got any good info innit on what power and wot torque and wots da best.
p.s. do kent or piper give more power?
Fanks
you are right, red is to "instigate" more power or even retard it if you get a lot of wheel slip, thats what the numbers are for
and blue is for gaining torque that you may have lost low down due to a 4 branch manifold. again similar principle to the red, but obv torque oriented
Yeah, its not as simple as that, it's to do with the way they are machined I think. Not sure which way round it is but somebody told me once that one has greater mass closer to the edge of the pulley and hence it holds more inertia. This will help an engine with low torque to hold its revs, say on a hill.
Saying that they look very similar.
MC
wickid man, glad ur clearin this up for me so which is better power or torque?
i think they shud make a purple pulley combining the 2 that wud be da bomb!
so if i get a purple one will that give me more of both?
Fraid not, your just living in dream land, I believe its one or the other!
MC
Torque is the amount of twisting force your engine produces
Power (bhp) is the amount of work done by the engine in a certain amount of time
Take (for arguments sake) an 800cc bike and a 2000cc car. both make 130bhp. The car can easily pull two people and a tonne of body work because the big engine produces lots of torque.
The bike makes very low torque compared to the car and slows down with just two people riding. It revs much higher than the car engine (ie. it's doing lots of work) thats why it has the same horseppower
Can't see how a heavy cam pulley produces more torque. My standard steel one's heavier than both so that must be why my 1.3 has 105 ftlb of torque! :lol:
Fraid not, your just living in dream land, I believe its one or the other!
MC
damn. i'd got my hope's up about that.
the steel one isnt adjustable so you cant vary the effect across the torque curve, which is the important bit here.
Ste_Nova
30-07-04, 10:56 AM
the steel one isnt adjustable so you cant vary the effect across the torque curve, which is the important bit here.
mine is... i milled out the locating pin hole :lol:
Whilst at it you should have taken some weight off of it and as a result got higher revs and more bhp! I would.
MC
Hmmm
All seems stupid to me as i have asked a similar question before and got told not to bother with Verneers as they are a waste of money.
they are ok on a valver or a silly tuned 8v as you may need the adjustment there. but most of the time they wont make any difference.
also the weight of the vernier is so little (and even the steel ones for that matter.) that as long as its farely well ballenced you wont notice or even be able to measure the difference. the colour is to do with what suites your engine
Well, the bloke I was talkin to the other nite said that before and after figures for fitting the high horsepower pulley were 92 and 107bhp.
MC
sounds like he was little more than a couple of degrees out on his timing :o
retrosi
04-08-04, 11:47 PM
just to point out power is related to the work done over time but....
Engineers relate the power produced by an engine to be proportional to the torque muliplied by the angular velocity of the flywheel. (or road wheel contact with additional factors) hence the use of dynos for engine bed testing and rolling roads for road contact.
Infact the power is a complicated thing to work out as factors such as air mass intake, fuel consumption etc all contribute.
just to clear up a myth of work done....thats a simplified school method.
Engineers relate the power produced by an engine to be proportional to the torque muliplied by the angular velocity of the flywheel.
:o :? :| so red or blue?
i like power, so red.
but if you like torque then blue
Depends how your engine is already tuned!
If you have a relatively peaky engine, you could use a torque pulley (blue) to help things out in the mid range. The opposite could apply too.
MC
i like power, so red.
but if you like torque then blue
you should have blue. your all talk :roll:
just to clear one thing up. weather its RED or BLUE makes no difference what so ever. it could be orrange purple green or whatever you want. they just make them coloured to sute your engine detailing :roll: they spin at half the rpm of the crank anyway so will not make any difference to rotational weight. that is all done by lightening the bottom end. all they do is allow you to adjust the cam timing perfetly.
everyone know's red goes faster
but blue is the colour of electricity which is very fast
This is getting stupid now, the colour has nothing to do with bhp or torque, its just a way of differentiating the two types. the pulleys are machined differently, then painted so that they can tell the difference when taking them off of the shelf.
MC
S_Gault
08-08-04, 12:24 PM
I never read as much bollocks in my life!!!
i can get you a cam pulley in any colour.. all they do is allow you to dial in the cam timing on a dyno..
sure if you skim the head on one engine it will retard the cam timing when you take up the belt tension!!! so it doesnt matter what colour it is. and depending on the build , setting the cam timing on one engine can improve the power and torque!!
If you modify the engine, then effective cam timing is a must to gain any benefits fro your mods.
i make my own, that allow me to set them up, but they really arent that different in theory from kent/ piper..
this is just another case of those "experts" advising on stuff they know nothing about. ive come accross this thime and time again.. bad advice is worse than none at all!
How about this- if i paint my engine red will it have more torque than if i paint it blue!!! same thing.
Wise up!
Steven
thank you. two more people who are not dillusioned into thinking colour makes things go faster.lol
it was almost like talking to a load of blond girls in the pub. lol
S_Gault
08-08-04, 02:31 PM
oh the point about the lighness- yes it does make a difference..
anything that moves or turns that can be made lighter will have an effect.
i build a lot of N/A cosworth engines for rallying and I machine all the pulleys as well as the aux drive and remove fuel pump lobes etc.. it all adds up!!
as for the blue and red being machined differnetly.. no they are exactly same.. I was also the instigator with Piper in getting the Hard anodoised grey ones a la BDA.
Steven
hmmm BDA i love the sound of those
:roll:
what about blue, pink or green coolant??!?!?!?!
The colour black absorbs heat better than any other, so if you had black coolant, the heat would disipate into the water better resulting in a cooler engine and possibly more bhp?
MC
Of course it isn't that simple, a cooler engine could possibly cope with more ignition advance and compression and that where gains would come from. Would probably work well with a red pulley.
MC
this is just another case of those "experts" advising on stuff they know nothing about. ive come accross this thime and time again.. bad advice is worse than none at all!
you seem a bit slow on the uptake sir :lol:
AnThoNYnOvA
09-08-04, 02:03 PM
could u cut a power pulley and torque pully in half stick both bits toghter toghter and u have half and half go out and buy 2 this works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 8)
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