16se 16xe conrod length

[therealnovaboy]

Does anyone know the conrod length for a 16se and a 16xe.

Perhapse there is an online cataloge with various sizes listed ?

Cheers

[philip]

129.75mm for 16xe, 99.9% sure c16se will be the same length as too 1400s, just alter crank stroke + bore for ech engine,

[therealnovaboy]

cheers philip.

Am i right in thinking the 16v rod cant be used on the 8v piston?

[philip]

What is it your looking at doing? If can get pin dimentions and they match up, there shouldn't be a problem. I know the 16v pistons have the pins sweated on, not sure what the setup is on the 8v but imagine would be the same.

Merit lover, bazil, mowgl or tom reid may be able to confirm though.

[mowgli]

the 16xe & e16se have the same length rods iirc

[therealnovaboy]

I can't find any high comp 16se pistons. So I was going see if I could use forged 16v pistons instead as I already have forged rods for a 16v. I need to see what the xe piston and rod length would be to work out how much the piston protrudes the block when I know the piston compression height.

The comp hight of a xe and se piston are the same and wasn't sure if the rod was longer to give a higher CR.

[Gazza808]

crown on the x16xe high comp piston will be completely wrong for your 8v,
will need aload of machine work, then be a terrible shape for power after

[philip]

Use a flat top forged piston to up comp possibly. Give martin bowyer a buzz, may have to keep trying as can be very hard to get hold of, but he does some cracking motors, he's doing some machine work for a couple heads I'm doing at moment.

[meritlover]

I have just taken time out from building my moon-rocket to write you a response which does not really answer your question.

providing the small-end size of the rod is the same there shouldnt be an issue. i cant remember whether the gudgeon pin floats on the rod or on the piston on these. Some engines it runs on the piston, some the rod but ultimately providing there is an oil hole on the small end it will cover you for either.

One of the best ways to up compression is to improve VE (which is after all what ultimately makes power). If you can flow (pack) more air in to the cylinder per stroke, then you have more air to squeeze into the same area, thus upping dynamic CR....and the nice spin off is that you make more power.

as i keep saying, static (theoretical) CR's may be a good guide to get you in the ball park, but so much can change due to cam timing and overlap that it becomes almost meaning less once the engine starts to turn.

Another instance is where you could find you increase CR and then get pinking where you didnt before (you are bound too as chances are you have best adv timing already), so you back off the timing a couple of degrees and end up with an engine that produces the same (or less) power than it did before especially in the speed sites where VE is most efficient. You might gain down the lower end but ultimately loose out on peak power.

Then you need to start playing with different fuels to get back on it. If you compete in a class where you are limited to 'pump-gas', this can be an issue.

you could skim the life out your head but have valve clearance issues...so you machine out pockets and the knock on effect is that you lower the CR again. Decking the block would be the best solution to keep the combustion chamber the same shape, but you can run into the issue above again and need to pay attention to crown heights....time to get out the Plasticine ....

now i have to go and put on some pants.

[mowgli]

you could get away with xe pistons with the 8v head, as long as you keep to a sensible cam. the compression will be high, possibly too high for what you want, so you might need to machine some out of the crown.

i have a scheme to fit the crank pistons & rods from the z18xe to my e16se..i know they will physically fit, the only thing slowing me down, apart from being skint, is the oil pump, which i need to look into.

[therealnovaboy]

“ the pistons have a designed “deck height” to give a compression ratio of approximately 11.4:1, and when installed should protrude above the block face at TDC by 0.4mm +/- 0.1mm”
Im trying to get as close to this as possible as a starting point. I understand what you are saying meritlover but without actualy building the engine dynoing it and racing it youll never know what dynamic/static CR is best. Im either going to make it better or worse and due to the above statement I hope it will be the latter.

Assuming that the rods are the same length, theoreticaly i have worked out that the STD XE piston will be less than 11.4:1 however CR is increased. The next step is to work out the piston to block face height of an high comp XE piston, and see whether or not the crown can be machined to suit.

Phillip what is the forged flat top piston that you are on about?

[philip]

I'm sure omega/accralite do a flat top piston, I can find out though. I did have their high comp pistons on a build I did for myself but I can't think now whether they gave 11.7 or 12.5:1 CR based on standard gasket/chamber......was 3years ago. Thinking about it, if go on omega website they may have info of their pistons as pdfs, could be wrong but worth a go.

[therealnovaboy]

is that for an SE or XE?

I couldnt find a cataloge for omega pistons.

[philip]

Xe matey. Ill ring a mate up tomoz and pick his brains for you and let you know pistoton options.

[therealnovaboy]

excellent thanks.

[Novasport]

Didn't Cosworth produce a high compression piston for the 1.6 8v engine? Might be worth contacting them.

[mowgli]

i think they might be a lot of money.....

[Andy]

i think they might be a lot of money.....
I KNOW they will be a lot of money lol lol lol

[philip]

Sure my omegas were app 430/440 a set. Only rate omega/accralite and cp, but each builder will have own preference too anyway.