13SB turbo conversion

[Edd]

Following on from this http://www.pngclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=163711

Next winter I will be getting the low comp 1300 bottom end I have rebuilt ready for the turbo conversion

Plan is to fit the bottom end to the big valve cylinder head on the engine already in the car, remove the ast2 cam and fit a new gte one I have

I'll be using the Irmscher injection set up as well as a Coutenay manifold and a T2 turbo, in the thread mentioned there's talk of what carbs could be used but I don't want to go down that route

Until now I have not given much thought to what management to use but someone has pointed my in the direction of these M Tech kits

http://www.mtechautomotive.co.uk/engine-management/systems/

Which kit is more suitable ?
Are these any good ?
Anyone using one ?
Suitable for what I'm building ?
It says you could program it yourself ?
Anyone ? Or experience needed ?
Do you keep the dizzy or switch to coil packs ?

They offer a r/r set up, being in Wiltshire it's not far from me so should I take it to them ? Waste of money ? As we do have a r/r in town at TSR which have installed some make of after market ecu and mapped it on a mates car

Seems a good price too, as I don't want too much expense lol

Tbh I have no clue really when it comes to this stuff and could do with help/info/experiences from everyone

Edd

[craig green]

You need a book by Corky Bell, Maximum boost.

Putting it on standalone is the way to go though it will occur expense & commitment beyond what some people would blow on a complete build.

IMO the effect adding a low pressure turbo to the small 8v engines has is very effective. Upto 6-7psi the std management with a r/r FPR is perfectly adequate & a much quicker & cheaper route to getting on the road. At those kind of boost levels a grands worth of standalone & mapping is arguably wasted. However you arent going to get much more than 10psi/or a bar max if you spec the whole engine accordingly in which case you would benefit standalone management but I wonder how much more power/driveability you would have versus the cheaper alternative.

Maybe a halfway house could be to use the Bosch ECU from the Irmscher kit & use a mapped management for the ign which in itself would add power & safety over running the std dizzy.

[Edd]

Decent FPR then, plus that pikey pressure switch or not ?

So what your saying is don't bother with that M Tech kit at all then ?

I want 130bhp tho :d lol

[Andy]

is 32/34 on xr2 turbo technics out the question?
Old chevette 1300 pistons are apparently low comp

[craig green]

Edd the pressure arguably does nothing, they partly have a bad rep because you can wire them to put the ECU into cold (rich) running mode via the CTS. Wheras Courtenay used it to trigger the full throttle map via the TPS. The FPR is doing the fuelling anyway so it's not vital, it saves butchering the loom further for starters.

I didnt read the MTECh link, however there are plenty of tuners that will supply & map a standalone ECU for what appears to be a cheap price. Bear in mind with more money they would complete a far neater installation, put more time & effort into the loom that they will make & obv map it a lot more thoroughly which is down to their level of skill & expertise anyway. Think more closer to 2 grand for a job you'd be proud of.

You mention 'programming it yourself'. As a function yeah, with the software on a laptop & a lead it is mappable or able to be played with as with any ECU, hardly a selling point & again if you havent got a clue, more harm than good is possible.

I wouldnt argue standalone isnt the best option here, but true costs & the end result just need to be compared with the ease & simplicity of doing it the simple way in your own garage. With a fuel pressure gauge & a borrowed or bought wideband monitor, you could have the motor up & runniung pretty quickly. Of all the threads I've seen in Vauxhall forums, standalone is never without complications & further expense that was never accounted for. A 2.0LET may justify standalone but does a 13SB???

[Edd]

is 32/34 on xr2 turbo technics out the question?
Old chevette 1300 pistons are apparently low comp
I did mean this thread mate http://www.pngclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=163812 so I have seen the carb ideas floating about in that thread
It is a option, but I'm not sold by that idea apart from it will probably be cheap, I like cheap, bloody Sport has cost loads :( lol plus is that going tone easy to set up ?

The pistons I have are GM low comp ones

Craig, so I could have it running, without blowing up or melting itself, just with the addition of a decent FPR whilst monitoring it with a wideband ?

[craig green]

Yeah pretty much. All assuming the FPR & pump/fuel lines are upto the task & the wastegate on the turbo operates as it should.
Likewise the oil supply to & from the turbo are very important to how long it will last.

Considering fitting a carb would be nutts, you essentially have fuel injection anyway with a nice inlet plenum, using carbs would only be of historic relevance or rewind 25 years & injection stuff was beyond the means of a home mechanics budget.

[Edd]

mmmmm happy days then :)

[Angus Closier]

packs ?
As we do have a r/r in town at TSR which have installed some make of after market ecu and mapped it on a mates car

Seems a good price too, as I don't want too much expense lol
Edd

I have seem some very dodge motors due to that place, I Wouldnt go near the place.

You have done so much for the sport, why not finish it properly with the engine.

Have you taken into consideration Megasquirt but building it yourself?
The mapping could be done at a few differant locations.
If I were you id pay the money and do the engine properly like the rest of the car.

Carbs could be an option but might be hard to get it perfect unlike fully mappable ecu etc.

Just my 2p

[craig green]

Tbh I doubt TSR would touch it, not for thousands of pounds & I would talk Edd out of that anyways.

[Edd]

Tbh I just want to find the cheapest and most reliable way of doing it, which by the sounds of it is decent FPR and a wideband set up

[mowgli]

i'll scan that old car mag i've got with the blydenstein 1300 astra turbo, then send it to you. pm me your email addy, it might be some use.

[Edd]

Will do mate cheers

[C612DNM]

Didn't Micro Dynamics do a FPR for turbos. I have one of their rising-rate regulators on my 1600 race engine. They used to do all sorts of old-school stuff like boost-retard units that backed off the timing to save you from holy-piston-damage. There must be loads of this stuff laying around in garages where people have gone all high tech and "computer says NO".

[mowgli]

bill fitted a circuit box that retarded the timing.

[C612DNM]

That will have been a Micro-Dynamics boost-retard unit. They used them on the old BRDC MG-Metro Challenge cars which ran up to 1.8bar boost!!!!!! Yep, a BL A-series running like a pressure cooker!!

Go here:
http://www.autocar-electrical.com/new/main.php/turbos/

Seek and ye shall find.

Now get that thing running before sunrise....

[Edd]

lol won't be that quick

Nice link ! So I would need EMS 5, EMS 6 and PIC 5 ?????

But now I don't need management or so it seems it will probably happen in late summer

Be interesting to see the article mowgli has too

Loving all this help and info :)

[bazil]

Hmm this is now tempting me to go spacer plate and a few wee black boxes now too lollollol

[Edd]

Thought you might think that when you seen them boxes Bazil lol

[draper]

i thougt you were having a supercharger anyway edd ?

[Edd]

Nope scrapped that idea a while back, cost of a Rotrex went stupid tbh

Then I came across the Coutenay convert 1300, GM low comp pistons, Courtenay manifold, downpipe and a T2 turbo all tho that's about as loose as Jordan's gash lol

Plus I wanted something a bit different than carbs for my Sport

[Stuart]

Ummmmm Having had a damn good read up on 'counterfeit' Megasquirt units the Mtech stuff isnt getting a very warm and toasty feedback from the Ms forums.... But then again the board might be a different 'evolution' of the design etc. I'd kinda be inclined to go with a MS3 from a proper supplier in that case.

Electronics are NOT a bad thing FFS, just because old people cant cope with them dosent mean they are rubbish. I'd sooner run management and know that the fuelling and spark is setup right rather than hoping the nasty box of randomness is raising the fuel rate and backing out the ignition in some vaguely uncontrolled way.

FTR, I've started to work out what improvements to make to MS to of course get branded with the counterfeit stamp, but then with luck all that will be the 'same' is the base ECU software and the user interface, but it will take a spot of time

[sport]

Intresting thread here, will be keeping an eye on this.