View Full Version : Man dead, passenger paralysed from neck down
Nova_Sean
17-08-10, 07:43 PM
Surprised this hasn't been posted yet.
Copied from Passionfords
http://passionford.com/forum/general-discussion/363484-smashed-up-sapphire-1.html
RIP to the lad and best wishes to the passengers.
No disrespect and best wishes to the families in their tragic time but why? People die in crashes all the time and it doesn't get mentioned on the Local News or PNG
Nova_Sean
17-08-10, 07:51 PM
because most other crashes aren't caused by a plasterboard nail grip filled to the road?
Edit* http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs143.ash2/40486_10150230196235244_658795243_14200025_3219268 _n.jpg
if you read on some more, the brakes failed apprantly.
im guessing the glued nails didnt help!
edit. i would be surprised if those nails still stood after a car drove over them. unless there was alot.
someone also posted a good point, how many cars would have gone past them, had burst tires before the accident.
it is a terrible shame, people dont deserve to die like that, but i would say this quote is a harsh reality.
QUOTE:
does anyone know if they were wearing seatbelts??
i wonder what time the nail was put down. were there loads of them??? i wonder how many vehicles had a flat tyre before the target vehicles approached. Id of thought that would have snapped off the ground, mastik or not with a high speed impact.
exactly!!! a blowout at 30 or 40 is very unlikely to lead to a spin let alone the carnage seen here.
speed killed that lad, the nail was just a contributing factor.
i think people need their head checked to drive at 2 or even 3 times the speed limit in a built up area with 3 up showing off to mates.....
manslaughter maybe if they could prove intent, attempted murder no way. at the speed limit no one would have been hurt.
I doubt the police will do anything. and IMO rightly so. the guy was clearly speeding and as people say "street racing", showing off, cruising or what ever we want to call it and anyone who races in the streets is regarded as comitting a crime anyway. so theyd be looking for a criminal who targetted a criminal. wheres the motivation?? hardly innocent people getting hurt is it??
IMO id rather a load of car nuts got hurt acting like prats now than in the future the same car nuts injure or kill other innocents who had nothing to do with it.
like it or not something needs to be done about "street racing" and boy racers etc.
this country has plenty of country lanes where you can drive fast within the speed limit and get plenty of thrills. just your mates cant watch you!!
theres plenty of race tracks and places like pod if you want to race properly.
cunts cant go racing on the public highway........
protest will achieve nothing.
i suspect locals are fed up of being kept up late by idiots driving at high speed on thier local roads
Ive been in areas with boy racers racing round etc and its a ****ing menace as they dont keep out of your way and cut everyone up, go through reds, ignore give ways etc hoping that because they are fast and loud, people will keep out their way.
is it any surprise theres been some backlash?? no.
What lowlives get kicks from doing stuff like that?
I'd like to glue their faces to a railway line.
Tommy_nova
17-08-10, 08:03 PM
Yea that is sick as fu*k who ever did thats is a complete bell end....!!
best wishes to the families of the guys in the crash..
R.I.P. that is so sad to read:(
Guy drives over nail, shreds tyre, crashes and dies? Haven't really read the link but I'm summarising here.
I guess there was an element of speeding involved too judging by some of the quotes martin copied?
Guy drives over nail, shreds tyre, crashes and dies? Haven't really read the link but I'm summarising here.
I guess there was an element of speeding involved too judging by some of the quotes martin copied?ask bmw156, he knows EVERYTHING about it, it seems.
Ahh I now see, maybe i need to read more. That's shocking
The ins and outs of whether the guy was speeding or not is irrelevant IMO.
The simple fact of the matter is, someone has glued nails down on a section of dual carriageway in a vigilante attempt to stop street racers.
Trouble is, many vehicles have to speed legally. I wonder how whoever did this would have felt if the ambulance that was rushing to the aid of his son/daughter/wife etc had hit these nails and crashed?
Whoever it was needs catching, and locking up. Absolutely discusting.
Angus Closier
17-08-10, 08:51 PM
IMO Doing the likes of this (nails on road) are worse than the speeding itself.
Some people are sick and or didnt really think what they did through.
Simple solution to speeding and thats the police, not nails.
Hoochie
17-08-10, 09:00 PM
In my eyes these people are no better than the speeding racers, innocent drivers could have been seriously injured, children in backs of cars, even bikers, it really does not bear thinking about, that could have caused absolute carnage.
Total fcuktards!!!!!
craig green
17-08-10, 09:04 PM
I'm just wondering how you glue a load of upturned nails to a dual carriageway in time for the glue to set without being run down yourself or a vehicle coming along & mincing them all over.
Still pretty shocking behaviour.
I'm just wondering how you glue a load of upturned nails to a dual carriageway in time for the glue to set without being run down yourself or a vehicle coming along & mincing them all over.
Still pretty shocking behaviour.
They only have to stay upright, dont have to set. And from reading the thread its a quiet stretch of road.
The amount of fecking screws i've had in my tyres over the years that have probably only be laying flat tells me that would have done the job just fine :mad:
To me this comes under terrorism. Its like someone who is fed up with hoodies going out and putting a bomb under a park bench just because hoodies occasionally use it.
Can't believe how angry its made me to be fair.
i hope whoever did it dies of aids. thats how strongly i feel about it.
taffnova
17-08-10, 09:45 PM
r.i.p to those who died and hope the rest pull through who ever done this should be hung and slaughtered and hope they never have a night sleep with out guilt running through there mind again
Derick-Sport
17-08-10, 09:48 PM
rip to the lad, that thread is absolutly disgusting some of the post are so disrespectful makes me sick to think!
i hope whoever did it dies of aids. thats how strongly i feel about it.+1
Nails in the eyes for a proper punishment... nails infected with aids
gc_vaux
17-08-10, 09:59 PM
Nails in the eyes for a proper punishment... nails infected with aids
+1
Fooookin fools. what would go through someones head to make them think thats a good or entertaining thing to do... wonder how they feel about it now.
r.i.p to the man and the sapphire :confused:
Just spent ages reading through the whole thread on PF
Rip to the driver.
This has made me think - there is medical advise being given in that post that could potentially be of detriment to a patient, its quite frankly appauling - i would hazard a guess that the person giving 'advice' is a johnner (st johns ambulance) as they use old acronyms
Would people be interested in learning what to do as a FPOS at an RTC,
if there is the demand i would be happy to spend an hour or more if necessary teaching people what to do
I should add at this point that i am a trauma orientated paramedic.
Would people be interested in learning what to do as a FPOS at an RTC,
if there is the demand i would be happy to spend an hour or more if necessary teaching people what to do
I should add at this point that i am a trauma orientated paramedic.
That would make for a good entry in the articles section IMO.
I should add at this point that i am a trauma orientated paramedic.
Kudos to you sir, I couldn't do what you do.
Angus Closier
17-08-10, 11:23 PM
Just spent ages reading through the whole thread on PF
Rip to the driver.
This has made me think - there is medical advise being given in that post that could potentially be of detriment to a patient, its quite frankly appauling - i would hazard a guess that the person giving 'advice' is a johnner (st johns ambulance) as they use old acronyms
Would people be interested in learning what to do as a FPOS at an RTC,
if there is the demand i would be happy to spend an hour or more if necessary teaching people what to do
I should add at this point that i am a trauma orientated paramedic.
I think that would be good, I wouldnt know what to do and im sure lots of others wouldnt either.
Rep to you.
ask bmw156, he knows EVERYTHING about it, it seems.
fook off, did you not read i put QUOTE, as that whole lot was quoted,
your a cck
That would make for a good entry in the articles section IMO.
I'd second that,
I'm fortunate I only have to clean up the debris after a rta but I think I'd actually freeze if I was confronted with the sight of that sierra if I were first on the scene ( I've read the pf thread )
Knowing a few basic skills that could help sombody in a situation like that would be a good thing,
i hope whoever did it dies of aids. thats how strongly i feel about it.
Seconded thats fukking horrible, cant read that thread as it reminds me of my mate who we found out about at billing, he is still in hospital now but is recovering but still that thread has brought tears to my eyes!
That would make for a good entry in the articles section IMO.
i'll get on to it, might take a while as i want to make it accurate and concise
brainsnova
18-08-10, 02:29 AM
R.I.P :cry:
fook off, did you not read i put QUOTE, as that whole lot was quoted,
your a cckthink you find its says QUOTE IMO , so keep your veiws to yourself, you wasnt there, ,so why make out you know everything you idiot.:tosser:
Nova_Sean
18-08-10, 08:00 AM
I have just read on anotjer forum that the police are treating this as a murder case. Lets hope whoever did it gets caught
look people.. a splodge of gripfill on an ally dryline wall plug is not going to withstand much force on the road.
it would simply fold over in normal conditions..
just look at stingers, they are made from strong steel and fixed to a frame & snap off when driven over.
if one actually was found embedded on the tyre, then the leakage hole would be tiny.
i assume the driver was going at silly mph....
the screw person might just have had a relative killed by a speeding motorist..
there are too many variables here.. a sapphire is light on the back end at the best of times. it could have simply been driver error.
all the above is conjecture
to be fair, there was a big meet on at southend saturdaynight when it happened, and then there was a london run, which this may or may not be connected but alot of my mates went down this road that night, some even helped out clean up, and my opinion is that yer he may of been driving like a c0ck but there is NO excuse to mastic nails in a road ffs!! And my thoughts are with the poor lad who died and the others involved. If it wasnt for curt and ollie meeting me at southend i would of most probably gone to london and gone down this road, shame people feel like they have to resort to measures like that. Idiots
rubachuk
18-08-10, 05:04 PM
Read the whole thread this aft. Can't honestly see where anyone states as fact that there was more than one of these plasterboard screws which in my opinion probably got there by some innocent means.
FACT seems to be (from "RST in breaking" I think the user name was who seems to know the deceased/injured well and was there at the time) that the cause was brake pads overheating and possible fluid boiling while the lad was racing a Seat.
EDIT - Maybe shouldn't have stated as FACT in hindsight, I don't know it to be fact to the point where I should be highlighting it in capitals. I just found the posts by "RST in breaking" seem to be written from a position of knowledge rather than from assumption like most of the threads on there.
its not untill you watch one of ur mates being buried that you realise how easy it can happen...and it was sad that it was that way i found out.
and yes some of those posts are sick!
look people.. a splodge of gripfill on an ally dryline wall plug is not going to withstand much force on the road. it would simply fold over in normal conditions.. just look at stingers, they are made from strong steel and fixed to a frame & snap off when driven over.
Irrelevant. It was stuck there to puncture a tyre. It doesn't matter how good an engineering brain the guy had. Screws manage to penetrate tyres from lying down in the road, so im sure something held in an upright position would have a far better hit rate.
if one actually was found embedded on the tyre, then the leakage hole would be tiny.
Ive used loads of diferent types of those drywall inserts. Some of them have a big gap down one side of them, others actually do have a large hole through the middle. In my opinion, one of those things could rapidly deflate a tyre in seconds if it went in at an angle.
i assume the driver was going at silly mph....
Irrelevant. Could have been a motorcyclist, emergency vehicle etc. Yes, if he was indeed speeding, then he may well have survived if he wasn't. IMO thats not the issue here. People kill themselves or get killed in cars every day be it from stupidity/carelessness or the stupididy and carelessness of others. The fact of the matter is these nails glued to the road are neither in the realms of stupidity or carelessness. Its point blank premedatated intent to cause harm to other people
the screw person might just have had a relative killed by a speeding motorist..
I know that is conjecture, so I will assume you arn't thinking for a second that is a viable excuse for behaviour like that
there are too many variables here.. a sapphire is light on the back end at the best of times. it could have simply been driver error.
The lightness of the backend of a sierra, and the dubious talent of said sierra driver has absolutely nothing to do with someone gluing nails to a road.
Obviously the facts are a bit thin on the ground, and I agree that its entirely possible there was only one tack, and it had nothing to do with the accident. My opinion stems from the possibility there wWAS more than one, and it WAS a contributing factor.
I also cannot see how for one second, if that picture of the tack is genuine, how it could have got there in any sort of 'innocent' circumstance!
its not untill you watch one of ur mates being buried that you realise how easy it can happen...and it was sad that it was that way i found out.
true that, one of my good mates had to bury his missis a year ago due to a drunken driver overtaking on a blind corner.
It's sh1t like that, that puts me off driving
lee. how could anyone put a load of them on the road with enough time to get it to set properly without being spotted by traffic or causing another vehicle to hit them first???... unless it was a chevronned bit at the end of a dual carriageway or similar..
Lee makes a valid point, but you can't ignore the fact that if the guy wasn't speeding/racing/whatever then the accident would have almost certainly been far less severe.
There's two wrongs there - the tack in the road and the guy racing/speeding/whatever. Neither are excusable, and its easy to muse that one without the other could have avoided the crash. But as they say, hindsight is a wonderful thing.
At the end of the day, someone lost their life in an accident. Its a tragedy that could have been avoided, but thats the way with most accidents.
[edit] Still reading through the thread now. Talk of the whys and what-ifs aside, this (which I assume came from someone who was present at the time):
but to u sick people that started to record them on the floor having fits
and laughing at them
...is macabre.
rubachuk
19-08-10, 12:17 AM
Sorry Lee, but your post's based entirely on the assumption that some "vigilante" has been out laying a trap of screws. Of which there is not a shred of evidence aside from a picture of one screw, which may or may not be at or near the scene of the accident. Comment or proof of further screws (or even photographed screw) has not been made.
Sadly, to me, this "screw" thing seems to be someone who has seen a single item in a road and would like to attribute it to the death of a friend/member of the scene.
I don't believe for a second there was anything malicious going on. Simply a guy illegally racing, who has come to the end of a 1/4 mile straight so in all probability doing 3 figure speeds (he was racing in a Cossie FFS) with previously cooked brakes running out of talent/luck/properly maintained car.
I have compassion for the deceased, injured and associated families amd friends involved only. I do not have respect. I have sympathy for the families.
2 of my mates rescued the driver and passenger from the wrecked cossie, they were covered in blood.
they saw the whole thing happen, and it was due to the tyres exploding as they drove over those massive nails that were planted on the road, (approx 500 scattered along the road).
it has really messed with my friends heads as they helped as much as they could and saw everything.
Lee makes a valid point, but you can't ignore the fact that if the guy wasn't speeding/racing/whatever then the accident would have almost certainly been far less severe.
I never disputed that. My point was regardless of whether there was a crash or not, someone glued a load of nails to the road. In my eyes its a completely seperate issue. So I can ignore the fact he may have survived if he was going slower, because it could have easily have been a motorcyclist or an ambulance or whatever.
lee. how could anyone put a load of them on the road with enough time to get it to set properly without being spotted by traffic or causing another vehicle to hit them first???... unless it was a chevronned bit at the end of a dual carriageway or similar..
How do crop circles appear? The thread mentioned it was a quiet road (hense why its used for street racing apparently). But my opinion was based on the possibility that it WAS done, not how it was done..... hense....
Sorry Lee, but your post's based entirely on the assumption that some "vigilante" has been out laying a trap of screws. Of which there is not a shred of evidence aside from a picture of one screw, which may or may not be at or near the scene of the accident. Comment or proof of further screws (or even photographed screw) has not been made.
below..
Obviously the facts are a bit thin on the ground, and I agree that its entirely possible there was only one tack, and it had nothing to do with the accident. My opinion stems from the possibility there WAS more than one, and it WAS a contributing factor.
But...
2 of my mates rescued the driver and passenger from the wrecked cossie, they were covered in blood.
they saw the whole thing happen, and it was due to the tyres exploding as they drove over those massive nails that were planted on the road, (approx 500 scattered along the road).
...tell this poor guy there's no evidence.
dident really know what it would feel like to know how the boys friends and family would feel till tonight i got told my mate crashed last night and has broken his neck he had to crawly to the nearest house whar he collapsed on thier door step. rip to the boy who died hope the other guy pulls threw.
All of you that are arguing the 'ifs' 'whats' and 'buts' make me fooking sick, who cares if this lad was speeding, racing or whatever, i would hazard a guess we have all done it at some point, i know i have and i was lucky to grow up and realise it is silly, stupid and plain dangerous, but i still speed every now and then, hence having points on my licence, i came very very close to losing a close mate to a car crash not too long ago, (he is still in hospital now i might add) those who were at billing will know exactly how torn up me and Andy were that night, yet most of you seem to care more about the ins and outs of what caused this crash, be it the driver or someone trying to cut street racing in the area, who fcuking cares, it has happened, but you lot dont seem to care that a young life has been lost and one has been destroyed!!
I never ever thought id say this about anyone on this forum ever, but you make me sick!
I think until you loses a friend through a car crash (whatever caused it), you may sometimes seem slightly cold hearted when you discuss the why it happened and how it could of been avoided etc.. its the same with anything in life, until you are affected by something yourself, you dont neccessarily have strong emotions about it...
but I dont think anyone is being overly insensitive on here. I lost a mate a few years back, it was his own fault coz he had been drinking but it didnt make it any less painful. But i will admit, that I get angry sometimes when i think back on it. He was an idiot to get into his car and he could of killed someone else but it was a heat of the moment thing and nothing will change the outcome.
Whatever actually happened to cause this accident, unless you knew the people involved personally, you are always going to be a bit detached. opinions are opinions. nothing else.
who ever put those nails down is just an idiot full stop and I think we can all just agree on the fact that we hope he\she gets caught and prosecuted.
spud , I hope your mate comes out of hospital soon and is 100% again. hugz
I have my own opinions on this loss of life but I choose to keep them to myself. 3 dead friends in 4 years through RTA,s makes discrection the better part of valour.
its the same with anything in life, until you are affected by something yourself, you dont neccessarily have strong emotions about it...
When I tell people I had cancer, they say "Oh I'm sorry" - my response is usually "Why, it wasn't your fault I had it" lol
Anyway. I did think of an appropriate analogy about this earlier.
You're in a crowded area. You get out three juggling balls and start to juggle. Someone purposefully elbows one into your face. Annoying, but no great problem. Now you get out three large knives and juggle with them. Someone elbows one into your face again. You're now seriously injured. Who's to blame; the person who elbowed the knife into your face? Or you for doing something inappropriate in that location?
^ thats a hypothetical scenario btw, answers are not required. lol
i would hazard a guess we have all done it at some point, i know i have
High speed on an enclosed road? No.
MattBrown
20-08-10, 03:07 PM
Very sad story.
It seems a combination of speed, and the nails.
If one or the other wasnt there, then they MAY or MAY NOT be alive today.
Its a hard thing to have to do, imagine the families etc?
And even more so the passengers families.
R.I.P.
Very sad story.
It seems a combination of speed, and the nails.
If one or the other wasnt there, then they MAY or MAY NOT be alive today.
Its a hard thing to have to do, imagine the families etc?
And even more so the passengers families.
R.I.P.
And the witnesses/people who helped, they will all be thinking did kill the guy/paralyse the other guy by getting them out!
C612DNM
20-08-10, 10:18 PM
There seems to be a fair degree of "he said, she said" going on here.
I agree with our good friend in green.
One thing I always said to my pupils when instructing on circuit, "when driving on the road, always drive as if you expect to meet yourself coming the other way - you should be OK then".
I often hear of people moaning about "this and that was in the road - shouldn't be allowed", and the way of looking at it from a professional point of view is you should treat every road like the next corner will present a hazard in the road - whether that be someone parked, a tractor going about it's business, someone elses accident, or a pile of horse... And you should drive in a manner to be aware and ready to meet that, however many wheels you're on.
Remember that the public highways were here before the motor car, WE (drivers) do not have the god given right to all of it just because we pay road tax. That was instigated to pay for the repairs to the highways caused by horseless carriages, and hasn't gone away!!
Sincere condolences to the people who lost their lives through this pointless incident.
Link no worky now, but there dry wall fixings anyway. Not screws, nails or any other anti gravity picture hanging device.
WE (drivers) do not have the god given right to all of it just because we pay road tax. That was instigated to pay for the repairs to the highways caused by horseless carriages, and hasn't gone away!!
so...what happens with it now, coz i know down here in west cornwall we have pot holes 3-5 inches deep. :mad:
MattBrown
20-08-10, 11:50 PM
so...what happens with it now, coz i know down here in west cornwall we have pot holes 3-5 inches deep. :mad:
Walkers have the most rights, then cyclists lol
I dunno, but for £10-£30 a month, its not bad tbh;)
Anyway. I did think of an appropriate analogy about this earlier.
You're in a crowded area. You get out three juggling balls and start to juggle. Someone purposefully elbows one into your face. Annoying, but no great problem. Now you get out three large knives and juggle with them. Someone elbows one into your face again. You're now seriously injured. Who's to blame; the person who elbowed the knife into your face? Or you for doing something inappropriate in that location?
^ thats a hypothetical scenario btw, answers are not required. lol
Tough titties, you're getting a reply lol
Thats a crap analogy for this situation, because it implies someone was being a tit and juggling knives in a crowded area, and someone accidentally elbows them and they stab themself in the face. I agree, the juggler was a tit and reaped what he sowed. Thats the end of the story probably.
Adjusting the scenario to better fit the scene, someone is annoyed at this bloke who keeps juggling knives in a public place, so to get revenge, he sidles up to the man and shoves him just at the right moment so the juggler stabs himself in the face. SO now we have two factors.
One is the silly man juggling knives, and as before, i will not comment.
The second is the guy who deliberately attempted to make the man stab himself in the face. His nudge could have made a knife fly off and stab someone else in the face, but he didn't much care. SO sorry, I think the man who deliberately shoved him is the man who is more to blame for the face stabbing.
THATS my point. Hense why ive not made any passing comment on the ins and outs of the guy driving the car. I have lost a friend to a car accident as well (and he was driving like an ass, killed himself, his girlfriend, and put his girlfriends sister in a coma of which she has still not come out of). My comments have only been about the nails.
One thing I always said to my pupils when instructing on circuit, "when driving on the road, always drive as if you expect to meet yourself coming the other way - you should be OK then".
I often hear of people moaning about "this and that was in the road - shouldn't be allowed", and the way of looking at it from a professional point of view is you should treat every road like the next corner will present a hazard in the road - whether that be someone parked, a tractor going about it's business, someone elses accident, or a pile of horse... And you should drive in a manner to be aware and ready to meet that, however many wheels you're on.
None of these things are malicious. Are you saying that i should drive at 70 down the motorway and be constantly aware of the possibility a load of nails that may have been put there by an unsavoury character? Or drive down a country road and be ready for a man to step out of the hedge and throw a brick at my windscreen at every second? Of course not, and If I was to drive down a road and get a brick fatally lobbed in my face, I would hope any discussion on a forum about it would not get into a heated debate about whether if I was going a bit slower, the brick may not have penetrated the windscreen!!!
i just have a major issue with these types of threads.
even passion ford moved it to members only, so they must have been getting some bad responses.
it is always bad when someone dies or is badly injured on the road....
my near fatal one from 1995 still affects me physically & mentally to this day.
i wasn't even speeding or drunk or anything...i was going to a shop.
to me, someone who choses to race someone else on a public road at well over a ton has no regard for others
Thats a crap analogy for this situation, because it implies someone was being a tit and juggling knives in a crowded area, and someone accidentally elbows them and they stab themself in the face.
I didn't say accidentally, I said purposefully :p and the analogy still stands, as if he wasn't juggling in an inappropriate place he wouldn't have been stabbed. Not saying the elbower is not to blame, of course not, but you have to apportion blame to the guy for doing something in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Not saying the elbower is not to blame, of course not, but you have to apportion blame to the guy for doing something in the wrong place at the wrong time.
We'll have to agree to disagree then :)
EDIT and your right, you did say purposefully, too many ciders last night lol
sr jack
21-08-10, 04:15 PM
it was a few of my mates that see it happen,
they had to get the boys out of the car which cant off been nice but they said the car was on fire and their was petrol leeking, the boys was all in veryy bad way.
their is a housing estate very close to were the racing goes on so they would of put up with alot of noise, in my eyes that may explain the nails :wtf: ,im not blaiming anyone.
i think we are taking flowers to the seen tonight.
r.i.p to those who are hurt.
i have been hunting round the web, and seen the youtube footage... right where it happened, on the central reservation is a large group of cars, with people out watching.. nobody can tell me that this was the only car to have travelled down the road at huge speed at that time...
i still believe the screw is a red herring, and i hadn't noticed it at first, but the glue stuff is on the threads leaving the large head with no glue, thus it was not stuck down..
if the tyres blew out, or the brakes failed, why is there so much tyre squeal???
i'm not planning to post the link, or comment further
even if the tyres blew out and a spin was induced it would still squeal
I agree that he wouldnt of been the only driver to go down that road at speed,
Either way its sad that someone lost his life, and others were injured.
I have my own opinion of the speeds involved from a professional standpoint,
i have also seen the video
we all take chances at times, and when you do you have to be prepared to pay the ultimate price :(
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