View Full Version : mid mounted nova
hi, i am buying a unfinished mid mounted nova project next monday, i will start a project thread and post up pics of it then, is their many mid mounted novas around, i seen the one on this site all ready but i cant find anymore on the internet, i am looking for more ideas, im going to use a vectra subframe and a 1.6 16v engine
MattBrown
09-04-10, 04:38 PM
Yes its been done, normally theyre rear engine rear drive, or twin engine, I think its gonna be rare.
Post up some pics asap:thumb:
TBH using the vectra subfram is going to be heavy, the old style cav/calibra etc ones will be lighter and easier to mount.
There are a few about, the one chip bought from big boys toys is probably the best known his has vauxsport livery iirc.
Also a few on here in the projects.
basically, you are very brave.
many years ago, (25) a bloke made a mid mounted tarmac rally nova with a 8v 1800 gte astra engine. he remade the whole rear end as a spaceframe & did the panels in grp.
it is possible, but a load of work, the fuel system is hard work, you will be needing something like skoda 120 coolant pipes, and the gear linkage will be tricky, look at mk1/2 astras for simple linkages.
then you need to keep the noise & smell out of the cockpit with some sort of double glazed firewall.
i don't know of a diy one that was made road legal.. there is a link to a convertible mid engined one in the corsa a site under prototypes, i'll unt it out later...
good luck with it
MattBrown
09-04-10, 04:45 PM
TBH using the vectra subfram is going to be heavy, the old style cav/calibra etc ones will be lighter and easier to mount.
There are a few about, the one chip bought from big boys toys is probably the best known his has vauxsport livery iirc.
Also a few on here in the projects.
He bought it?
Thats a hugggeeee fail in my eyes:roll:
i don't know of a diy one that was made road legal
Did you never see boost beast?
Theres been at least 10 i can think of!
He bought it?
Thats a hugggeeee fail in my eyes:roll:
IIRC and others know better than me that it was a standard xe when he bought it and then fitted the let? and the 5 stud conversion etc.
The guy who done the original fab work was a nova hero back in the day, got a feeling he actually originally converted andy bishops nova aswell (or did i dream this? )
Did you never see boost beast?
Theres been at least 10 i can think of!
that thing may have had a reg number on it, but it was a show car that always breaks down..
i said that i didn't know of one, i didn't say there weren't any....
are there any png ones???
There was guy up near heathrow that built one then ot kicked out his unit and cant for the life of me remember his name.
Southie
09-04-10, 04:58 PM
This thread reminds me of this one CLICKY (http://www.pngclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=105681)
This thread reminds me of this one CLICKY (http://www.pngclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=105681)
Thats the boy!
im going to use it for motorsprot, its allready kinda space framed. i was going to use the vectra subframe because i have 2 of them lying around the place. mabey i could use a corsa b spaceframe, the lighter the better :thumb:
corsa b's have no subframe....
corsa b's have no subframe....
ok so thats out the window then lol
dude, drop the full front out of an astra or cav, cut the full back out the nova, get it in the hole, and use the cav inner wings welded into the nova shell.
I wouldn't waste your time IMO, it'll probably handle like poo. Ive NEVER seen one that can be used properly other than willy waving doughnuts. Even chip only uses his for drifting and his wallet has been well and truely thrown at it.
Obviously give it a crack, but I always add a warning in these type of builds. Dont expect it to instantly handle like an MR2. The front geometry will have to be completely redesigned, and then you'll probably have to add ballast here and there to get roughly near a driveable car. And even then, you'll probably still be owned by a well setup front drive Nova.
Not telling you your an idiot for doing it, just urging you to assess your reasons for doing it, and accepting its not gonna be incredible unless you put a LOT of graft and money into setup :)
I am with Lee - pointless really, but a giggle at shows etc I spose. Unless its really cheap, I wouldnt bother....
Something like that you would want to know that its all been done properly - some of the sheet I have bought to break in the has taught me not to trust anyone! lol
dj_wudgey
09-04-10, 06:42 PM
yea im with lee aswell ive never seen one handle well if you want something rwd go buy something rwd will be a good build to watch though!!
well the car will only be used for motorsport so it does not have to be 100%, the lad i am buying the car off of was fitting a vw beetle back axel and had a conversion plate made for a 2.0 16v redtop so the engine bolts straight on to the vw beetle gearbox
well the car will only be used for motorsport so it does not have to be 100%, the lad i am buying the car off of was fitting a vw beetle back axel and had a conversion plate made for a 2.0 16v redtop so the engine bolts straight on to the vw beetle gearbox
CHRIST!!!!!!! the last thing a rear engined nova needs is a beetle box & a redtop hanging out the back.....
it would have pulled wheelies & still have a crap gearbox.. ok, the later beetle suspension could be a goer, with 100pcd hubs and all, but the weight needs pushing as far forwards as possible, with maybe angled driveshafts to get the wheels far enough back to get the balance.....
well the car will only be used for motorsport so it does not have to be 100%
But thats a contradiction? Motorsport requires a car that actually handles better than a normal posey/road car?
And as Mowgli said, using a beetle box, for the car to actually have 5 forward gears the engine will have to be mounted behind the gearbox. I dont think its gonna fit with the tailgate closed, let alone do anthing but point the front end at Venus if it did lol so the only way you'll be able to use that gearbox is to fit a boxer engine, and they are made of chocolate so its pointless fitting a second hand one without a rebuild!
And I never saw a beetle win any races (Herbie wasn't real, I cried when i found that out when I was a kid :cry:) and Porsche, being stubborn, have only spent millions and 4 decades actually making an RR platform work lol
We're not being killjoys mate, we're just giving advice lol
strap a v8 in the back and use it for drag :d
drag
Thats what you would be doing too, dragging the tow eye along the floor lol
TBH the mid engined threads are the ones that usually never get finished!
TBH the mid engined threads are the ones that usually never get finished!
And when they do, they realise they are poo, cant make them road legal, and end up on ebay as 'unfinished projects'.
the gearbox and axel can be turned around then the engine will be right behind the seats, its not to hard to do this but it can be done
the gearbox and axel can be turned around then the engine will be right behind the seats, its not to hard to do this but it can be done
lol 5 reverse gears and one forward gen
the gearbox and axel can be turned around then the engine will be right behind the seats, its not to hard to do this but it can be done
How do you do that then?
EDIT^ as above. Is there some secret we dont know about beetle boxes where you can swap the geartrain around and make it spin the other way???
ya you have to change something around in the gearbox, my father had a autograss buggy with a ford granada engine mounted to the beetle box and a lad i know had a rover v8 mounted to a beetle gearbox
ya you have to change something around in the gearbox, my father had a autograss buggy with a ford granada engine mounted to the beetle box and a lad i know had a rover v8 mounted to a beetle gearbox
Interesting.
if that were the case it may be a more viable method to do a mid engined Nova, provided the engine would actually fit behind the front seats in a longditudinal position.
That at least eliminates the linkage issues, and would go a long way to creating far better weight distribution. Still left with geometry issues though.
Still going to stay skeptical till i see something actually built lol
Hopefully start my FR in a few months :)
Even chips car has had loads of intelligent thought put into the rear suspension, its still dire compared to leaving the engine in the front and just accepting the limits of FWD lol
if you want a rear/mid engine nova, just get a VX/elise and put a nova bodyshell on it
How do you do that then?
EDIT^ as above. Is there some secret we dont know about beetle boxes where you can swap the geartrain around and make it spin the other way???
you basically reverse the diff. its pretty much what the original hewland gearbox was. the linkage would be a nightmare
ste porter
10-04-10, 12:15 AM
awd the way forward!
if that were the case it may be a more viable method to do a mid engined Nova, provided the engine would actually fit behind the front seats in a longditudinal position.
not a hope in hell, between the b piller and the centre of the rear arch is basically 2ft, it was going to take some serious engineering to get a bike engine in the back so not a hope in hell of a red top and beetle box
unless the back was stretched
unless the back was stretchednot being funny but if he thinks hes using a corsa's subframe then what are the chances of him having the necessary skills to lengthen a car
Rick Draper
10-04-10, 01:40 PM
Dave France.....
Lee Chip iirc has done a few track days in his and he has given the rear suspension a full overhaul. IIRC he has not had chance to put it on a track as the block cracked either on the day of or the day before the track day he was going on.
Dave France.....
Lee Chip iirc has done a few track days in his and he has given the rear suspension a full overhaul. IIRC he has not had chance to put it on a track as the block cracked either on the day of or the day before the track day he was going on.i know he has been on a trackday with it as theres vids of him playing with evo's lol
http://www.facebook.com/#!/video/video.php?v=46091012790
Dave France.....
Lee Chip iirc has done a few track days in his and he has given the rear suspension a full overhaul. IIRC he has not had chance to put it on a track as the block cracked either on the day of or the day before the track day he was going on.
I was kind of using his as an exception to the rule and the last time I read about it, it was still suffering handling difficulties, I admit ive not been keeping tabs on it. But still backs up my point it needs a lot of money and expertise throwing at it to make it close to driveable
EDIT: Just watched that vid Luke, looks twitchy as fook lol
if you could get the engine right forward in behind the seats, and the wheels really close to the back, and used trailing arm suspension (something like carlton or old bmw 3 series so the wheels would fit.... with angled driveshafts, f1 teams have used them to get weight forward. and then stuck everything else in under the bonnet, it might work.. the rally one i remember from years back used something like a chevette or a viva front axle assy, but the rear end was made into a grp clamshell like a 205t16.
I was kind of using his as an exception to the rule and the last time I read about it, it was still suffering handling difficulties, I admit ive not been keeping tabs on it. But still backs up my point it needs a lot of money and expertise throwing at it to make it close to driveable
EDIT: Just watched that vid Luke, looks twitchy as fook lol
that was before the revised rear suspension i believe
If you read the comments he was running skinny wets on the rears and slicks up front due to damaged wheels, guessing it runs 5 stud on back or something so he couldn't swap them?
grasser26
10-04-10, 11:12 PM
Hi-I think the rally nove r/e rwd in the 90's was Ian Jemison's-a lot of it was fabricated.There was another in ccc mage about 10 yrs ago but it was the front of an astra in the boot of a nova.There's quite a few autograss cars that have vauxhall engines in the back-even a special buggy that uses corsa eng/box and front suspension.
i heard that a few of them are used for autograss but i couldn't find much info about them, i will be using my one for autocross, i all ready use my 1.6 16v nova for autocross but fwd is no fun. the best thing about mid mounted cars is that all the weight is on the back wheels so u get better grip than a rwd car with the engine in the front
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