Xe tuning

[turbojolt]

what would i need to do to get around 200hp


without nitrous or throttle-bodies

[turbojolt]

i was thinking cams what ones are best ?

headwork how much would this cost ?

exhaust manifold and system which one are best and cost wise how much ?


what else would it take

[Adam]

You wont get 200bhp without nitrous/throttle bodies/turbo


Unless you fabricate some custom inlet. Even then it would be time consuming and costly.


Considered carbs? You could get 200hp on weber 45s, cams, headwork, good exhaust manifold and system.

[ck]

200+ hp has been acheived many tmes on a std inlet on a c20xe...

quite an extensive spec tbh tho..

[Philsutton]

Why dont you want nitrous / throttle bodies? Has someone being telling you nightmare lies.

[Lee]

200+ hp has been acheived many tmes on a std inlet on a c20xe...

quite an extensive spec tbh tho..

Despite bejng achievable, i just dont see the point TBH. Why take the hardest route to good gains?

Im guesing the issue is budget, so as Ad said, some 45's or even 48's if your feeling like a mentalist and want to stick some ludicrous cams in it :)

[Philsutton]

pfffffffffft if its budget then nitrous should be top of the list, but people get all scared of it as some guy down the pub has told them that when he fitted some to his quad turbo ferrari it scattered its engine all down the road.

[ELLIS GSI]

so is nitrous 'safe'?

[Lee]

pfffffffffft if its budget then nitrous should be top of the list, but people get all scared of it as some guy down the pub has told them that when he fitted some to his quad turbo ferrari it scattered its engine all down the road.

LOL

Im anti nitrous purely as I dont like the idea of constantly having to top it up, and only being able to use it for a short while. But for 1/4 miling, its ideal and cheap power for the bucks!

Nitrous will happily scatter an engine everywhere if its not set up right! Same as most high end performance mods will. Yet more examples of noobs giving things a bad rep because they dont know how to use it properly! Set your engine up correctly for it and it is completely safe yes :)

EDIT: Unless your attacked by a group of triads on motorbikes carrying uzis. In this case, you have to shout 'NOZ' and dive for cover as the car explodes itself into the air.

[ELLIS GSI]

LOL

fair enough.

[Adam]

200+ hp has been acheived many tmes on a std inlet on a c20xe...
Where?


Nitrous is 100% safe as long as you dont go mental with it.

Depends what you want the car for really. Nitrous is pointless for a track car.



EDIT: Unless your attacked by a group of triads on motorbikes carrying uzis. In this case, you have to shout 'NOZ' and dive for cover as the car explodes itself into the air. ROFL lol
Yep, watch a completely NON flammable and non explosive substance blow a car to bits lol
Got to love F&F lol

[ELLIS GSI]

with using a 'safe' amount just for the 1/4 mile what time would i be looking at. as its at 16.1sec without??

[Lee]

If your doing it properly you should start small and work up. I wouldnt be going straight for a 50 shot on a 1.6 for example.

Times will vary entirely on how much you use and how well its set up tbh.

[Adam]

Aye, as said, it depends how you use it. You could use a single hit, but will probably get a lot of wheelspin due to the torque increase unless your running good tyres.
And the more you run the more stress you put on clutch/box/shafts

[Philsutton]

LOL

Im anti nitrous purely as I dont like the idea of constantly having to top it up, and only being able to use it for a short while. But for 1/4 miling, its ideal and cheap power for the bucks!

Nitrous will happily scatter an engine everywhere if its not set up right! Same as most high end performance mods will. Yet more examples of noobs giving things a bad rep because they dont know how to use it properly! Set your engine up correctly for it and it is completely safe yes :)




LOL youve seen my videos then? To be fair even ramming the biggest jets I could through a 1.2 / 1lt nova all it did was blow the carb to pieces, it couldnt actually draw enough of it onto the engine to cause any real damage.


On a 1.6 Id be tempted to run a 75bhp increase on a controller (not on a completely standard engine though) but the problem with having a direct shot is even if the engine can take it the clutch an rest of the car might not. For example when I fitted a direct 50bhp to the 1.2 nova an drove it down the road the clutch lasted less than a few seconds before it span its face off.

[Stuart]

vauge back to the topic lol.

Yes you can fit lairy cams, BUT you cant fit much larier than STD since the pistons limit the lift at TDC. So you'd need either machined pistons, or some aftermarket ones. This can help bump the CR up and a small overbore too. but youve then taken the engine to bits etc so "budget" is out of the water already lol

[craig green]

What I was going to say. You cant use mad cams unless the pistons have pockets to allow the extra lift.

Typically the std SFi inlet box & the motronic wont get you to 200bhp without NOS. There is a foreign chap on migweb building a custom inlet plenum & is looking at reaching the magic figures, but he is also having to optimise the mapping to do so. I cant remember if he's still on Motronic but that will limit it somewhat.

I say either use TB's or go down the LET route. Or put up with the SFi & Motronic & aim your cash at the braking/handling aspects of tuning. (eg; 4 pots & ATB diff)

[Jack]

Yep, watch a completely NON flammable and non explosive substance blow a car to bits lol
Got to love F&F lol
[off topic]

It was a cannister of compressed gas, it exploded due to the heat of the car catching fire expanding the gas inside.

[/off topic]

[meritlover]

[off topic]

It was a cannister of compressed gas, it exploded due to the heat of the car catching fire expanding the gas inside.

[/off topic]

:thumb:
...and the escaping gas increased the speed of the combusting car/burning fuel/oil so greatly it gives the effect of an explosion.

it is dangerous stuff, regardless of what you think you already know.

saying its non flammable or non explosive is the same is saying petrol or hydrogen isnt flammable or explosive without the presence of Oxygen....N2O isnt flammable without a burning fuel....

[Adam]

So within 3secs of a car catching fire, the nitrous bottle has been heated enough to make its contents expand and explode..... Hmmm
I guess thats Hollywood for you. lol

You can put a fire out with Nitrous oxide in its liquified state BTW
Due to its boiling point/pressure

ANYWAY, back on topic

[meritlover]

probably due to plastic solenoids/pvc hoses. you could put a fire out with any gas in a liquid state as long as it was cold enough, seeing as its vapour that burns and not the liquid gas.

[turbojolt]

i think throttle bodies are to expensive and dont just want to just make 200hp when the nitrous is turned on thats why

[Stuart]

lol you think a £500 set of TB's is expensive but you would happily spend atleast a grand, if not more on a bottom end with a heavily restricted inlet?

[turbojolt]

mate when did i ever say i wanted to keep the standard inlet lol


i just said i did not wont throttle bodies

[turbojolt]

any way are they only 500 i thourght they would end up costing 1500 or more with the new engine managment

like these (http://www.regal-shop.co.uk/acatalog/Cavalier_Dbilas_Throttle_Body_Conversions.html)

[meritlover]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ELECTRIC-SUPERCHARGER-TURBO-VAUXHALL-VECTRA-GSI-SRI-VXR_W0QQitemZ380040033444QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item3 80040033444&_trkparms=72%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C65%3A12&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14.l1308[/URL][URL="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ELECTRIC-SUPERCHARGER-TURBO-VAUXHALL-VECTRA-GSI-SRI-VXR_W0QQitemZ380040033444QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item3 80040033444&_l1308"] (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ELECTRIC-SUPERCHARGER-TURBO-VAUXHALL-VECTRA-GSI-SRI-VXR_W0QQitemZ380040033444QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item3 80040033444&_trkparms=72%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C65%3A12&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14.l1308)

[Stuart]

lmfao talk about find THE worst/most expensive "TB's" available for the XE

OK £500 for the TB's, £500 for the management and £500 for someone good to map it..... meh. You'll get atleast 70% of the TB/ECU cash back when you sell em.


So what do you want? What is the budget, what will the car be used for, how often do you want to rebuild it etc? Answer those then you can get a better guide

[turbojolt]

the car will be a every day car for fast road use so don't want to have to rebuild it every week budget wise i don't know as of yet but what do you think how much would i be looking at spending for this type of car




and meritlover i don't think that will be any different from the other crap on eBay do you lol

[Stuart]

reliable + 200bhp - TB's = hmmm I'd say atleast £3.5K depending on the state of the bottom end and how well you can source/fabricate stuff.

[turbojolt]

is that with rebuilding the engine Stuart



and no labour charge apart from things like machine work and engine mapping

[Stuart]

erm well yes, otherwise you WONT get cams in that can get you the power... along with the higher compression/headwork that will be needed + a custom inlet

[turbojolt]

hmmmm seems rather expensive lol


maybe i should thing along the turbo route instead lol

[Philsutton]

Rebuilding engines isnt cheap and unlike most people who seem to think that any monkey can do it.

If you want cheap reliable 200+bhp get a C20LET or nitrous and a set of ARP bolts minimium.

TB's are great but they arent that cheap to do right and I would suggest doing the bottom end anyway with that with some steel rods as you'll be sending a few of them through the block otherwise IMO.
If your using it for fast road then will need all of that 200bhp for what like 5% of the driving if that.

[turbojolt]

so my thought that 200hp would be easy to get out of a xe on the cheap was wrong then lol

[Philsutton]

no, just the way you want to do it, plenty of people have got alot more than 200bhp out of a c20xe for well under 1k.

[turbojolt]

so how can i do it lol

oh and phill that corsa is proper mental mate good work lol

[Philsutton]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8zVMde311w


Ok I realise I might be digging myself a hole here (as the engine did finally give way?)but you dont have to go that extreme. Proof that you can get good results without money.

That made 266bhp on the rollers and its a standard XE with a little dabble of nitrous on top.

Most people will knock nitrous until they have played with it theirselves.

[turbojolt]

woo what did you do to it can you tell me the complete spec i wont that car lol

[Philsutton]

C20XE in a stripped nova, with about a 100bhp shot of nitrous and that is all. Very cheap and very fast.

[turbojolt]

how long did it last